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:: Saturday, November 21st, 2009RappCity
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"Something Wicked This Way Comes"
10/24/05 · 2:10 pm :: posted by JC RappCity
I think the vegetarians are to blame. They want us to stop eating meat. Vegeterrorists have been making up all these weird animal diseases ...just to scare us into becoming a meatless society living on whole grains, fruits, vegetables and occasional forms of soy..shaped into faux animal parts. This group means for us to chew the cud, not the fat!
Wild Turkey
I don't know about you, but I'm worried that a nice, fresh, wild Turkey may not be the "thing" to eat this Thanksgiving. Well, not unless I first take it to the Vet and make sure it doesn't have a temperature ... before I cook it!
Between Mad Cow, Avian Flu, and Mercury and PCB's in much of the the fish we buy... today I'm even scared of my Pork Chops!
Did you even know there is even a new Pig disease out there?
Streptococcus Suis... a bacterium, killed at least forty farmers in Sichuan Province this past summer. But, don't worry say the Chinese, the fatal outbreak is now, "Under control."
Let's hope so. We're starting to run really low on dinner choices!
The World Health Organization (WHO) announced this week that Avian bird flu (H5N1) will probably mutate into a human to human form any day now, with a Pandemic to follow.
But fears about a Pandemic may be, "exaggerated," according to a European Union (EU) spokesperson from Great Britain.
Now let me see...
Scientists and doctors are saying, "Look out, " and politicians (representing tourism, trade and money) are saying, "Don't worry." Tough call....
It kind of brings back memories of a little flick called JAWS ... and that nice little summer resort of AMITY not wanting to lose summer business.
Well, I'm going with the scientists on this one, filling my pantry and staying out of zoos, bird stores and public statues and fountains this winter.
Dominos
This flu is tearing though Asia and Europe like gossip in a small town.
Millions of birds have died or been euthanized already, and at least 60 people are known dead in Asia ... and this flu has not even jumped to human form yet!
But a report this week says a sick Indonesian boy may be the first case of "Human to Human" transmission.
His father died after handling infected birds, and the boy, at home, had never been near them. Testing is ongoing. We should know soon.
Poultry all over the world are now being enclosed in pens. Those of you hooked on "Free Range Chicken" may want to reconsider it for a while ... (OK... so you get a few hormones and antibiotics in your food, how bad can it be? Cough...Cough).
H5N1 has passed through most of Asia (where it began) and is now in Europe. Romania, then Turkey were first.
This week, Wild Swans were found dead in Croatia, making the EU pass an "Emergency Ban" on poultry imports from all of the Balkans.
Greece may also have it, but tests were inconclusive, and new results are pending. But the Greeks are very scared. Sales of poultry are down 70% in just the past week!
Panic stricken neighbors are reacting as well. Albanian television reported thousands of Greek chickens were killed at the border, when Albanians refused to let them enter the country.
Pet bird smuggling is also a big problem. Taiwan seized a big haul of Flu infected exotic pet birds from Mainland China last week. The Taiwan Coastguard has now set up a dragnet for illegal trafficking. They are taking it so seriously they are offering 3.6 million Taiwan dollars (US $107,462) for tip-offs on smuggling!
In Great Britain this week, a parrot (part of a shipment of 148 other parrots) imported from Suriname, (South America), tested positive for H5N1. The bird was already in quarantine, caged next to a shipment of 216 nifected birds from Taiwan (that was real smart).
The UK's Chief Veterinary Officer said since the bird was in a quarantined biosecured area, there is no reason to worry that Great Britain is now infected. However all the birds were destroyed, and all personnel were given antiviral just as a, "precaution."
Finland recently reported "possible" bird flu in Seagulls!
Finland also shares an 800-mile eastern border with Russia and a western border with Sweden, Norway and the Baltic states.
I even heard a rumor this week that the flu is already up in northern Canada (Not a far flight for a bird from or Russia).
On the Homefront
Cape Codders should be very concerned about all of this.
Bird migration is the number one spreader of this disease, and we have one of the richest areas of bird migration in the country.
Living here is like living in a natural bird sanctuary.
Dozens of species live here all year, but migratory birds are a large part of the Cape too.
I love watching the Canada Geese, flying in V formation across the sky. They always let me know how soon to get out the sweater or the bathing suit.
But the Geese don't just do a "Fly By."
They stop and visit us too. They rest in our ponds and wetlands. They "hang out." They share the airways and waterways with Ducks, Swans and many other waterfowl.
They fly the same airspace as Hawks, Osprey's, Falcons and Eagles.
And they all drink from the same water fountains as the Seagulls.
It sounds so nice, but these days it's, not so good," say the experts.
And if you have any kind of outdoors birds (even pets), it gets even worse.
No Jackpot
H5N1 is not a winning number. And is headed our way.
This is no longer conjecture, but fact. It's now just a question of when...
And as sick birds approach our shores, they will probably first infect the birds that already live here. That will probably be the first sign. Most human deaths, so far, have been when people either handled or ate sick birds, or came in contact with them in some other way.
When we see the signs that people are beginning to pass the virus from person to person (instead of just from bird to person), we'd better be ready!
Usually a simple flu shot keeps us from getting sick. And although some years the flu is worse than others, this flu is a whole other ballgame!
Immunity
H5N1, as you may have already heard, has never before been seen by scientists. The H5 part is old hat to doctors, but this N1 part is a brand new strain, and we humans have no antibodies or defense against it.
Our immune systems don't have a clue what to do if infected.
And that's the very reason we need to take this very seriously and prepare for the possibility of a worldwide Pandemic, which could kill (according to some estimates) up to150 million of us!
It's a very much like when the Native Americans were introduced to Smallpox by Europeans. Their bodies never saw the bug beforem and had no defense against it at all. It pretty well killed every one of them that came in contact with it.
Same thing here. We are now the "New" Native Americans.
The hardest part is knowing that it's coming, and knowing we have no vaccine to prevent it ... and no antibiotics to cure it.
I don't mean to sound alarmed, but......(Can anyone hear us out there??? Hellllllp!!!!)!
The Drug People
Many countries around the world have been stockpiling one of only two antivirals available for months already. They are hoping to to be able to fend off, or at least hold back the tide of this looming threat.
EU officials, again this week, urged member states to "stockpile" all they can.
How much do we have? At last count, maybe 100,000 doses.
And the USA is way down on the waiting list of the drug companies that make the drugs. Far behind many other countries, we are actually closer to the bottom of the list than the top.
Why?
Well, it's not because people hate us (although so many do), but it's because NO ONE in this administration (Someone hold me back...) ever asked to be on the list! Not until just a few weeks ago!
Can you believe that? This is bewidlering....but true!
Good work Washington. Take another bow George. FEMA? Surgeon General? Anyone else want to take some credit? Curtains coming down.
Grrrrrrrrr...
Anyway, the H5N1 virus has already shown resistance to one of the antivirals that showed great promise at one time: TAMIFLU.
It seems the TAMIFLU pill has been totally overused to battlle common influenza for the last few years in Asia.
The LANCET medical journal reported resistance to anti-influenza drugs was growing worldwide, and that in China alone, drug resistance to antivirals exceeded seventy percent!
Despite that, this week in the US, druggists are working overtime filling prescriptions for all the TAMIFLU they have in stock (Shades of the CIPPRO stockpilings.).
An antiviral flu medicine that doesn't work anymore is not what we want to be hearing with a Pandemic knocking at the door!
But take heart people. Another antiviral called RELENZA (generically known as ZANAMIVIR), is being tested as we speak.
This one will be inhaled, rather than taken by pill.
It is also being made into an injectable/intravenous form ...to make it stronger and faster working.
But the biggest reason research and supply are taking so long, is that most drug companies are not even equipped to make flu drugs.
It seems there is no profit in making them. Since flu viruses mutate from year to year, at the end of the season the drug companies get stuck with a lot of product, and whatever is left ... gets tossed.
That's why we occasionally have shortages and why only two companies are even in the "Flu Biz."
The Bacon Needs to Simmer
It's times like this when our Government could actually do something to help us.
Washington (Are they awake yet?) should be throwing a lot of money, at this. Tossing it wildly at any and all the people who can actually help for a change!
Let's back burner the Pork and corruption for a few months ...and take the monies good American taxpayers have already paid (in good faith, for good government), and have Washington use as much of it as they need to save some American lives!
The crooked politicians can come back to extort, divert, overbudget, give themselves raises, take junkets and steal all they want again next year. But right now, let them please give us back our stolen money so we can fix this problem. Deal?
Let's Wake Up over at the White House, at Congress at FEMA and at the Treasury. Open up those "Cabinet Doors" and send forth your Secretaries with arms full of Federal Funds for Flu!
Point of fact: The President was all set to cut $25 billion from the Centers for Disease Control (among other cuts in Medicare, AIDS research and more) to cover the costs of Hurricane Katrina.
Let's just hope he has the sense to "table" the proposal for the moment.
I think Washington insiders really think they are immune from a real Plague (Gee, I wonder how many doses of antiviral Congress has stockpiled for themselves).
I say: "A Pox on Phony, Patronizing, Pork Barrel Politico's. You WILL Pay the Piper!"
REWARD
How about a Reward?
How about a Billion Dollars for the first company to come up with the "Cure" or a "Working Vaccine" for H5N1?
How about another "Three to Four Billion," to get a few more companies to set up labs to reproduce whatever is eventually made and marketed by the main flu team?
We need "plenty of product!"
Hell..Let's toss TEN Billion at it!
Do those amounts sound big? President Bush has been spending a few Billion here, a few Billion there for a while already. He knows how to do it. This shouldn't be so hard.
A Billion is "Chump Change" to the corporate friends of Washington.
Hey ...if the Treasury is a little short, why don't we Borrow a Billion from Halliburton?
At NO interest.
We can offer the same deal to a few other big corporations too.
It would be a very patriotic thing for them to do, especially after all we've done for them!
Wait. I have another idea.
How about eliminating the tax cut?
Oh come on, just for the next two years or so.
Living is so much more fun than saving a few extra dollars, isn't it?
Oh wait, I forgot. The people with all the big money will get the antiviral anyway. How silly of me. Nevermind.
Scientists have told us it will could take about six months to even make a vaccine ...and that's only after we even know the final mutated form of the virus.
But, with BILLIONS of bucks attached to a drug contract (including extra bonuses for individual scientists), we could be swimming in alternative cures faster than we thought.
I say, "could," but, research might very well speed up (with a lot of overtime, double time and bonues). Who knows...
Money has an amazing way of getting things done.
For The Birds
Speaking of sick birds ... they do tend to leave little "packages" behind as they pass through our towns and villages (and usually on my car).
It also puts me in mind of a visit I had with some friends from New York a couple of summers ago.
I brought them to one of my favorite little Capespots for lunch. A nice little clam shack on the water. Nice fresh fried sifh and chips. The best!
So, there we were, eating and laughing, and having a grand old time, when a big fat Seagull (they sure know where to hang for the best meals) just swooped down and left a nice little gift for my friend ... right on her head! No joke. Then, adding the proverbial insult to injury, it also left a little present on her fried clams.
Now, I don't know how that ranks with any of you folks for embarrassing moments, but I was speechless. I couldn't think of a thing to say (yes me). In retrospect, however, I think it was probably a good thing my mouth was closed (for a change). I think I might be eating inside for a while. That Seagull might have friends.
Today, looking back at that amusing moment ... I somehow get the feeling that those carefree, beachfront, bird loving, "Who cares what crapped on my car," days may soon be gone forever.
I sure hope not.
How about declaring war on Avian Flu!
That's a war we can ALL support.
###JC
54 comments
Blog posts and comments are entirely the thoughts and ideas of the people who write them and in no way represent the views of CapeCodToday.com, eCape, Inc., or its employees or owners.
10/24/05 @ 5:29 pm
Anonymous [Visitor] writes:
In Great Britain this week, a parrot (part of a shipment of 148 other parrots) imported from Suriname, (South America), tested positive for H2N1- WRONG it was H5N1
Christopher Murphy [Visitor] writes:
Excellent read.Excellent point made.That is saying alot.I have been sitting in front of a PC for 7 and a half hours straight and I just read this article.Its nice to see someone else is taking this potential disaster seriously,afterall it does have the potential to kill indiscriminately,and then there is the bird flu to worry about!Though Im sure the US government and George will think of something great,maybe a new surface to bird missile.
Anonymous [Visitor] writes:
1 word: PARANOID
1st it was sars that was going to kill us all, and now its this avian flu. get a grip people
1st it was sars that was going to kill us all, and now its this avian flu. get a grip people
Anonymous [Visitor] writes:
Simple solution to save Cape Cod. Kill every bird, destroy every nest and use DHS resources to shoot down every migratory bird within 500 miles.
Or find a cure! Not a treatment but a cure for this class of influenza.
Too bad there is NO MONEY in cures. So you'll all die!
Or find a cure! Not a treatment but a cure for this class of influenza.
Too bad there is NO MONEY in cures. So you'll all die!
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
To the two guys from the TYPO Police and Anonymous.
Haven't you got better things to do?
This is all you get from me. Enjoy these few words.
Haven't you got better things to do?
This is all you get from me. Enjoy these few words.
Anonymous [Visitor] writes:
"I realize the entire f-ing world believes grammar is irrelevant anymore. It isn't."
I hesitate to follow-up one of these "furious" folks' postings with another, but this one was simply too tempting. Let's try "isn't relevant anymore", shall we?
Regardless: This was an enjoyable read, but branching into Halliburton and tax cuts diffused the bite of the main point a bit?
I hesitate to follow-up one of these "furious" folks' postings with another, but this one was simply too tempting. Let's try "isn't relevant anymore", shall we?
Regardless: This was an enjoyable read, but branching into Halliburton and tax cuts diffused the bite of the main point a bit?
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
Christopher:
Thanks for the kind words.
H5N1 certainly does need to be taken seriously.
It is a shame so many won't..until it's too late.
Thanks for the kind words.
H5N1 certainly does need to be taken seriously.
It is a shame so many won't..until it's too late.
Linguist [Visitor] writes:
Semiotician: the fact that he successfully communicated his meaning, which you proved by realizing that he meant the plural of zoo, proves that his punctuation was in fact totally irrelevant in this case. As far as his grammar, well, that is something that occurred in his head and not in the symbols he used to communicate -- and it is clear that he was thinking of the plural of zoo, not of the possessive of zoo. So his grammar was correct; it was his understanding of how to represent it in written English that was was incorrect -- which was irrelevant to both his meaning and your understanding. A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds...
WindFarmer [Visitor] writes:
Just install wind mills in Craigville and it will kill all birds. We will be safe and full of energy.
Anonymous [Visitor] writes:
Ahh come on, don't tell people to freak out and get ready. We need a little population control. "Their is nothing, I repeat NOTHING to worry about. Please return to your normal business."
B Keil [Visitor] writes:
I almost took you seriously until your true motivation and lack of intelligence shone brightly through your political ranting. Have you ever been accused of having an original thought? Come to think of it, just knowing there are more sick conspiracy crack-pots like you in this world prompts me to think that a full blown epidemic of the Avian Flue every few years might be a blessing in disguise as long as it eliminates your kind from the gene pool. And I VOTE.
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
To ALL:
Although comments are always welcome (pro or con) and discussion is encouraged here, profanity is not.
Anyone using it will have their post removed.
To the reader who liked my words but not the reference to Halliburton and tax cuts:
I feel that this administration has wasted so much money on favors (contracts and Pork) and tax cuts for their friends, that now that we really need extra money for emergencies, we will be forced to borrow it...further expanding our deficit and national debt.
That's not good.
Do we really have to cut funding for the CDC, Medicare, Social Security and school lunches (just to name a few) to pay our bills or have something for a "Rainy Day?" Not when some Fat Cats are still making "questionable" fortunes off our backs every minute.
Sometimes even those Fat Cats need to cough up some help.
Our country could, if well managed, well afford to be stay out of debt. This administration is like a kid with a credit card.
Just my opinion.
Thanks for writing.
Although comments are always welcome (pro or con) and discussion is encouraged here, profanity is not.
Anyone using it will have their post removed.
To the reader who liked my words but not the reference to Halliburton and tax cuts:
I feel that this administration has wasted so much money on favors (contracts and Pork) and tax cuts for their friends, that now that we really need extra money for emergencies, we will be forced to borrow it...further expanding our deficit and national debt.
That's not good.
Do we really have to cut funding for the CDC, Medicare, Social Security and school lunches (just to name a few) to pay our bills or have something for a "Rainy Day?" Not when some Fat Cats are still making "questionable" fortunes off our backs every minute.
Sometimes even those Fat Cats need to cough up some help.
Our country could, if well managed, well afford to be stay out of debt. This administration is like a kid with a credit card.
Just my opinion.
Thanks for writing.
any mouse [Visitor] writes:
A big reason why World War 1 ended in 1918 was the influenza pandemic took the fight out of everyone. Is history about to repeat itself?
And it takes 12-18 months to make flu antivirus because it's grown on chicken eggs. If the bonehead-in-chief would have allowed genetic engineering, in just 3 months the US could make as much as we could use - and sell. But instead, some other country will develop the science - and make the profits, because anti-science religious fanatics run Bush's brain. Good thinkin' Georgie. Go take another victory lap around the ranch.
And it takes 12-18 months to make flu antivirus because it's grown on chicken eggs. If the bonehead-in-chief would have allowed genetic engineering, in just 3 months the US could make as much as we could use - and sell. But instead, some other country will develop the science - and make the profits, because anti-science religious fanatics run Bush's brain. Good thinkin' Georgie. Go take another victory lap around the ranch.
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
Linguist:
LOL!
Windfarmer:
Chuckle...
B Keil:
Speaking of grammar. I seem to recognize yours.
People don't realize that "style" is part of how we write too.
It is very easy to disntinguish, even under a beard.
To the nameless people who visit this space just to hear themselves type:
Type louder. I still can't hear you.
To those not worried about Avian Flu:
Good luck.
LOL!
Windfarmer:
Chuckle...
B Keil:
Speaking of grammar. I seem to recognize yours.
People don't realize that "style" is part of how we write too.
It is very easy to disntinguish, even under a beard.
To the nameless people who visit this space just to hear themselves type:
Type louder. I still can't hear you.
To those not worried about Avian Flu:
Good luck.
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
Any Mouse:
Pandemics are forgotten like the rest of history it seems.
The 1918 pandemic is as much ancient history to some as is World War 2 or Segregation.
I do know we need to wait for the virus to arrive in its final form before we make a useful vaccine, but meanwhile we certainly need more research going on for antidotes.
We need more money for that ASAP.
Only so many chicken eggs are available (and chickens who get sick are currently being destroyed by the millions).
So I was pleased to hear that research is now also going on for a kind of "in vitro" form of artifical egg.
I heard about it on the news yesterday. It sounds promising.
Profits don't concern me as much as the thought of seeing millions of people coughing themselves to death around me.
But as you might imagine from my Blog, I AM for more government money spent on science. As much as they need ...to find the cure!
(Bone-Head in Chief" Hmmm... an interesting name...)
Pandemics are forgotten like the rest of history it seems.
The 1918 pandemic is as much ancient history to some as is World War 2 or Segregation.
I do know we need to wait for the virus to arrive in its final form before we make a useful vaccine, but meanwhile we certainly need more research going on for antidotes.
We need more money for that ASAP.
Only so many chicken eggs are available (and chickens who get sick are currently being destroyed by the millions).
So I was pleased to hear that research is now also going on for a kind of "in vitro" form of artifical egg.
I heard about it on the news yesterday. It sounds promising.
Profits don't concern me as much as the thought of seeing millions of people coughing themselves to death around me.
But as you might imagine from my Blog, I AM for more government money spent on science. As much as they need ...to find the cure!
(Bone-Head in Chief" Hmmm... an interesting name...)
Ron Grube (Old Coot) [Visitor] writes:
I live in the middle of the central flyway of magatory birds. I know that the snow geese nest in Siberia. They fly thrugh here by the milions. It will be only a mater of time before they bring bird flu to this contenent, and I am sure that they will. But if a pandamic comes to the western hemisphear it will come as an undumented alein, from the far East. I am more conserned with the migrations from the south. The wetbacks that come from Mexico and centrail america. I have no reason to cridicise these people for trying to better their lott, But I worry a lot about what desease they are bringing with them. They don't stop for a midical exam on there way here. (My grandparents did at Elles Island) A very large majority of these people are working in the food industy, packing plants, greenhouses, ethnic restrunts. Think about it with TB hepitides and other comuitable deseas shoudn't we be more piticular who handeles our food.Forgive my poor spelling, I have dylexia but i'm not dumb.
My Two Cents [Visitor] writes:
It amazes me: the vast number of Cape Cod residents who think they are immune from the rest of the goings on of the world. The brazeness, prejudice, even, of these people make me even more determined to get off of this awful rock.
I have never encountered such hatred and judgementalism
(I hope that's a word. I'd hate to get slammed by the "keeper of grammar!" We could be sending out an SOS that reads: "HELP!Were DYING!"
and THAT person would respond, "It's WE'RE....")
as I have been exposed to here.
JC wrote a wonderful piece. Thought provoking, inspiring, AND funny. That's great writing, JC.
For people to not only NOT comment on the potential disaster (I agree wholheartedly with you JC, BTW) but to instead focus on stupid things and create side issues, shows the narcissism of the commentor.
The issue is a flu that the WHO has been raising red flags about for months now. This is not an alarmist poster crying, "The sky is falling!"
Please, people, can we get back to the issue brought forth. And to any anon saying it's no big thing: Why are they destroying tens of millions of birds? Why is the WHO constantly putting out warnings?
If you have nothing but venom to spew, do those of us concerned with the issue a favor and don't comment at ALL.
I have never encountered such hatred and judgementalism
(I hope that's a word. I'd hate to get slammed by the "keeper of grammar!" We could be sending out an SOS that reads: "HELP!Were DYING!"
and THAT person would respond, "It's WE'RE....")
as I have been exposed to here.
JC wrote a wonderful piece. Thought provoking, inspiring, AND funny. That's great writing, JC.
For people to not only NOT comment on the potential disaster (I agree wholheartedly with you JC, BTW) but to instead focus on stupid things and create side issues, shows the narcissism of the commentor.
The issue is a flu that the WHO has been raising red flags about for months now. This is not an alarmist poster crying, "The sky is falling!"
Please, people, can we get back to the issue brought forth. And to any anon saying it's no big thing: Why are they destroying tens of millions of birds? Why is the WHO constantly putting out warnings?
If you have nothing but venom to spew, do those of us concerned with the issue a favor and don't comment at ALL.
Anonymous [Visitor] writes:
I'm curious
If the FDA says we can't get our prescription drugs from Europe because of inferior quality, why are we depending on flu vaccine from Canada and Europe? Or is this a foolish inconsistency?
If the FDA says we can't get our prescription drugs from Europe because of inferior quality, why are we depending on flu vaccine from Canada and Europe? Or is this a foolish inconsistency?
kiwi ( a flightless native NZ bird) [Visitor] writes:
JC.... nice of you to allow people to post their comments but notice mine where there, and now they aren't?
Is freedom of speech not alive in well in the USA or only if its PC ..JC???
As I said perhaps if george & tony spent less on iraq and more on the usa at home, maybe you would be a first world country leading the way in fighting this thing!
A leading New Zealand animal health professor, Roger Morris, has been at the forefront of international efforts to investigate and combat the virus.
However as it has been seen as an "asian" problem and only affecting "poor " nations like Vietnam and Indonesia,nothing done again by USA and European Communities.
However as your country only has around 30 million on the poverty line or living on the streets maybe george is hoping it may save him the trouble of trying to fix that problem??
Think I'm joking just look at New Orleans disaster relief!!!
Is freedom of speech not alive in well in the USA or only if its PC ..JC???
As I said perhaps if george & tony spent less on iraq and more on the usa at home, maybe you would be a first world country leading the way in fighting this thing!
A leading New Zealand animal health professor, Roger Morris, has been at the forefront of international efforts to investigate and combat the virus.
However as it has been seen as an "asian" problem and only affecting "poor " nations like Vietnam and Indonesia,nothing done again by USA and European Communities.
However as your country only has around 30 million on the poverty line or living on the streets maybe george is hoping it may save him the trouble of trying to fix that problem??
Think I'm joking just look at New Orleans disaster relief!!!
Sean Cavanaugh [Visitor] writes:
True, there's a lot of media hype right now concerning H5N1, but there's also a great deal about this outbreak people need to familiarize themselves with. I'm a former plant pathologist (specifically vector-borne cereal viruses common in wheat, barley, etc.), and while I have no expertise in human or animal viruses, I'm familiar enough with the terminology and methodologies to follow the technical articles and studies published in various medical and scientific journals, and what I'm learning is that in many aspects, H5N1 is more of a threat than even our hype-happy media makes it out to be.
In short, let me say there's no reason to panic, but there's ample reason to be prepared. Preparation requires information, and a good source for that can be found on the Flu Wiki (http://www.fluwikie.com/). It's hype-free and ad-free, relying on the input of informed contributors and professionals alike.
I've also found several decent articles in Nature (http://www.nature.com/nature/focus/avianflu/index.html#pandemic), many of which are free to access without a subscription.
A pandemic outbreak based on a mutated strain of H5N1 (which has yet to emerge) seems highly likely, perhaps even inevitable. Chances are also very likely it will resemble the 1918 influenza pandemic in terms of lethality and reproductive rate. At least during the initial waves. But what's profoundly different from 1918 is that we'll know it's coming. We'll have access to much more information about where the outbreaks are occuring (when they occur) and how to protect ourselves. It may very well get really ugly for awhile, and more so in certain parts of the world than others. Chances are good there will be a signficant amount of disruption in our daily lives. But all of it will eventually pass, and life for most people (especially those who were informed and prepared) will return to normal.
In short, let me say there's no reason to panic, but there's ample reason to be prepared. Preparation requires information, and a good source for that can be found on the Flu Wiki (http://www.fluwikie.com/). It's hype-free and ad-free, relying on the input of informed contributors and professionals alike.
I've also found several decent articles in Nature (http://www.nature.com/nature/focus/avianflu/index.html#pandemic), many of which are free to access without a subscription.
A pandemic outbreak based on a mutated strain of H5N1 (which has yet to emerge) seems highly likely, perhaps even inevitable. Chances are also very likely it will resemble the 1918 influenza pandemic in terms of lethality and reproductive rate. At least during the initial waves. But what's profoundly different from 1918 is that we'll know it's coming. We'll have access to much more information about where the outbreaks are occuring (when they occur) and how to protect ourselves. It may very well get really ugly for awhile, and more so in certain parts of the world than others. Chances are good there will be a signficant amount of disruption in our daily lives. But all of it will eventually pass, and life for most people (especially those who were informed and prepared) will return to normal.
My Two Cents [Visitor] writes:
Anon of 9:00
The vast majority of those drugs are OURS! Packed with a different label. It's a fallacy. It's just the gvt. trying to get Americans to pay top dollar to America. Look it up. It's even been on news shows like 60 minutes.
The vast majority of those drugs are OURS! Packed with a different label. It's a fallacy. It's just the gvt. trying to get Americans to pay top dollar to America. Look it up. It's even been on news shows like 60 minutes.
Drew [Member] writes:
This is certainly a subject we should all be aware of and informed on. I appreciate that JC has brought it up. However, it is not one that most of us are capable of discussing for lack of medical knowledge. This is one subject we should all be intelligent enough to shut our traps about, and listen to reasoned voices like Mr. Cavanaugh's above, for example. Politicizing a flu outbreak that has not yet occured is pathetic, as well as a distraction from the real issues involved. A crisis of this magnitude requires protocol be followed(something many here seem to be missing). I am confident that anyone's comments that were deleted here were examples of those who do not grasp proper conduct.
Here on Cape Cod, we have many excellent wildlife centers working closely with sick and injured birds. I would hate to see their hard work provide an open door to this problem here on Cape Cod and elswhere. I am sure this issue will be taken seriously by our wildlife advocates.
To JC:
Were tax cuts brought up because you feel we need more revenues to meet this crisis? This country has more than enough tax revenue. I would still like to see some manner of graduated progressive tax someday, but I don't see increasing taxes as the solution to our current problems.
Here on Cape Cod, we have many excellent wildlife centers working closely with sick and injured birds. I would hate to see their hard work provide an open door to this problem here on Cape Cod and elswhere. I am sure this issue will be taken seriously by our wildlife advocates.
To JC:
Were tax cuts brought up because you feel we need more revenues to meet this crisis? This country has more than enough tax revenue. I would still like to see some manner of graduated progressive tax someday, but I don't see increasing taxes as the solution to our current problems.
El Greco [Visitor] writes:
By the twitching of my thumbs...the vegetarians have done SOMETHING for us. When we rant and rave, we can just claim we have mad cow disease!
El Greco [Visitor] writes:
Oh, JC, I forgot. If you take your Wild Turkey from bottle, you don't have to worry about germs. Excuse me now, while I go pour a shot to help my mad cow disease.
Watch these birds! [Visitor] writes:
CapeCodToday sounds a very agressive, proWind Farm site. They picture wonderful digital image of Wind Farms. They are pro cheap energy.
You want to see a
the picture of smashed, bludgeoned bird
by wind farm in California?
Have a courage go to
http://www.biologicaldiversity.org/swcbd/programs/bdes/altamont/altamont.html
See.. the picture. Publish it!
And when let's have a discussion.
Let's have a full discussion, including side effects.
Osterville views are not the problem.
But, bird migration issues are ignored
on CapeCodToday constantly.
Is CapeCodToday paid by WindFarm Fathers?
You want to see a
the picture of smashed, bludgeoned bird
by wind farm in California?
Have a courage go to
http://www.biologicaldiversity.org/swcbd/programs/bdes/altamont/altamont.html
See.. the picture. Publish it!
And when let's have a discussion.
Let's have a full discussion, including side effects.
Osterville views are not the problem.
But, bird migration issues are ignored
on CapeCodToday constantly.
Is CapeCodToday paid by WindFarm Fathers?
AvianFluFish [Visitor] writes:
Does somebody already thought about it?
Wind farm near Craigville will kill some birds..may be a lot of birds and may be it will kill avaian flu birds.
And those birds will be eaten by fish.
And may be those fish will get avian desease too.
So...let' kill fish, birds and..go with cheap energy? Go where?
Wind farm near Craigville will kill some birds..may be a lot of birds and may be it will kill avaian flu birds.
And those birds will be eaten by fish.
And may be those fish will get avian desease too.
So...let' kill fish, birds and..go with cheap energy? Go where?
Kiwi (al flightless NZ native bird) [Visitor] writes:
Given that not so long ago we had seals dying from some mysterious virus in the north sea, that due to the large number of birth control and other hormone drugs flushed into the ecosystem many of the worlds sea creatures, alligators etc are developing as hermaphrodites or not breeding at all. Given that we are still reaping the rewards of DDT, Agent Orange,nuclear and toxic waste dumped out of site in the worlds oceans,or polluting the aquifiers plus the continual deforestation of vast tracts of rainforest so we can recline in comfort on our hard wood decks on our hardwood seats. Is it any wonder the world is fighting back!
Just look at the storms we are having, the magnitude of the hurricanes are some of the largest on record, we are experiencing droughts where before w had plenty of rainfall,deluges and mammoth hailstorms in places normal devoid of such occurances, huge tusnamis and the latest earthquake in pakistan.
Given the destruction man has wrought on this eden called Earth is it any wonder that she wants to shake of the nest of fles that insist on biting the hand that feeds them (pardon the mixed metaphor)
WAKE UP WORLD! reuse recycle stop buying Humvees that get 2mpg!! Get Bush to join the Kyoto agreement to reduce cfc's before we lose the ozone, stop selling all our old crap and drugs to poor nations just so we can make a quick billion, if Britain, USA, France, Germany & China et all stopped producing weapons guns nuclear warships and put that money into early education, health, irrigation & waste treatment, reforestation and the search for cheap non polluting power sources we would all be better off including the planet we all live on!
As one of your own native american chiefs said many years ago "when you've killed everything and plundered and destroyed the land, what then will be the value of your money? when you cannot eat or drink the bounty of the Earth?"
Just look at the storms we are having, the magnitude of the hurricanes are some of the largest on record, we are experiencing droughts where before w had plenty of rainfall,deluges and mammoth hailstorms in places normal devoid of such occurances, huge tusnamis and the latest earthquake in pakistan.
Given the destruction man has wrought on this eden called Earth is it any wonder that she wants to shake of the nest of fles that insist on biting the hand that feeds them (pardon the mixed metaphor)
WAKE UP WORLD! reuse recycle stop buying Humvees that get 2mpg!! Get Bush to join the Kyoto agreement to reduce cfc's before we lose the ozone, stop selling all our old crap and drugs to poor nations just so we can make a quick billion, if Britain, USA, France, Germany & China et all stopped producing weapons guns nuclear warships and put that money into early education, health, irrigation & waste treatment, reforestation and the search for cheap non polluting power sources we would all be better off including the planet we all live on!
As one of your own native american chiefs said many years ago "when you've killed everything and plundered and destroyed the land, what then will be the value of your money? when you cannot eat or drink the bounty of the Earth?"
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
Ron Grube (Old Coot):
You do make a decent point about immigrants possibly bringing in diseases if they come into our country without exams.
BUT tell me how many "White, middle class, Europeans" landing in this country at JFK, Logan and LAX are getting medical exams before landing?
Anyone of them could be bringing in TB, Flu's and other contagious diseases as they wander around our cities and towns.
Here on the Cape, International tourism is a big money maker in the summer.
Do we give everyone who comes here on vacation an exam?
It's all in the perspective.
I am sure Mexicans (and others who sneak in) would probably not bother to come, if Americans did not hire them when they got here.
Incidentally, your spelling may not be good, but I suspect even Linguist would agree with me that you do get your point across.
Thanks for stopping by.
You do make a decent point about immigrants possibly bringing in diseases if they come into our country without exams.
BUT tell me how many "White, middle class, Europeans" landing in this country at JFK, Logan and LAX are getting medical exams before landing?
Anyone of them could be bringing in TB, Flu's and other contagious diseases as they wander around our cities and towns.
Here on the Cape, International tourism is a big money maker in the summer.
Do we give everyone who comes here on vacation an exam?
It's all in the perspective.
I am sure Mexicans (and others who sneak in) would probably not bother to come, if Americans did not hire them when they got here.
Incidentally, your spelling may not be good, but I suspect even Linguist would agree with me that you do get your point across.
Thanks for stopping by.
Sean Cavanaugh [Visitor] writes:
Fish can't catch avian flu, but cats (and some other mammals) can.
In fact, this is a development the popular press isn't covering much -- H5N1 infections in mammals (particularly tigers and ferrets) exhibit broad tissue tropism and high virus titers in multiple organs, particularly the brain. Flu viruses typically don't exhibit broad tissue tropism; they usually remain close to the initial infection sites, e.g., nasal and sinus tissue, pharynx and upper respiratory tract. More severe forms make their way to the lower respiratory tract and sometimes to the intestines, but some strains of H5N1 are showing a preference for neurological tissue in mammals, particularly ferrets, yet not in birds. In short, this is alarming. When virus titers are high in the respiratory tract, it results in tissue damage to our sinuses, throat and lungs. As our bodies attempt to repair the damage, it increases blood flow and mucous production in the affected areas, causing the coughs, congestion, head and throat pain we associate with the seasonal flu. Respiratory tissue tropism alone can be very severe, leading to pneumonia with or without secondary bacteria infections. Approximately 36,000 people die of respiratory failure caused by the seasonal flu in the US every year. But the vast majority of people infected make a full and complete recovery.
Tissue tropism is a big deal. When a virus invades a cell, it replicates within the cell, and at a certain point, the cell bursts releasing the virus into surrounding cells. Multiply this a few million times, and you can see why viruses cause damage and pain. The respiratory tracts of healthy people are prepared for this, capable of withstanding substantial damage and replacing destroyed cells with new ones. Our digestive tracts are also very capable of sloughing off damaged cells and replacing them with healthy ones (although the process is never a pleasant one for obvious reasons). Brain tissue, however, is not prepared for this. Those who recover from brain infections invariably will have permanent neurological damage, which, depending on the part of the brain infected, might result in cognitive impairment, loss of motor skills, seizures, etc. Nasty, nasty stuff.
But this is in ferrets, so what's the big deal with regards to humans, right? Apparently -- and I only recently discovered this while reading an article in the Journal of Virology (http://jvi.asm.org) -- ferrets are an excellent model for human influenza studies. The authors of the article I read intranasally inoculated ferrets with four human isolates of H5N1, as well as nine avian and domestic chicken isolates. Seven of the avian isolates (i.e., viruses taken directly from infected birds) caused only mild infections in ferrets, and all virus replication was restricted to the upper respiratory tract. All four human isolates, as well as two of the avian isolates, caused lethal systemic infections (involving multiple organs, including neurotropism) in ferrets.
I doubt many of you have heard this reported by the mainstream press. Their focus seems to be on the high mortality rate of H5N1 infections in humans overall, as if "avian flu" is a distinct disease with uniform symptoms. It's anything but. I'm finding out there are several different isolates (strains) of H5N1 in circulation, some causing mild infections and others causing lethal systemic infections in mammals. As of the time of that article (late 2004), the molecular basis for the increased virulence of these H5N1 viruses is unresolved, i.e., they don't know why some H5N1 isolates produce mild symptoms and others are lethal. They also don't know how many different strains are currently in circulation. They keep finding new ones emerging in wild bird populations.
Which of these H5N1 strains will make the jump to a pandemic human influenza strain? Unknown.
I apologize if I'm rambling on this. Probably not the best forum for such discussions. I can send links to some of the scientific articles I've found to anyone who's interested. You can contact me via email (my address is my full name, without the space between first and last, at gmail.com).
In fact, this is a development the popular press isn't covering much -- H5N1 infections in mammals (particularly tigers and ferrets) exhibit broad tissue tropism and high virus titers in multiple organs, particularly the brain. Flu viruses typically don't exhibit broad tissue tropism; they usually remain close to the initial infection sites, e.g., nasal and sinus tissue, pharynx and upper respiratory tract. More severe forms make their way to the lower respiratory tract and sometimes to the intestines, but some strains of H5N1 are showing a preference for neurological tissue in mammals, particularly ferrets, yet not in birds. In short, this is alarming. When virus titers are high in the respiratory tract, it results in tissue damage to our sinuses, throat and lungs. As our bodies attempt to repair the damage, it increases blood flow and mucous production in the affected areas, causing the coughs, congestion, head and throat pain we associate with the seasonal flu. Respiratory tissue tropism alone can be very severe, leading to pneumonia with or without secondary bacteria infections. Approximately 36,000 people die of respiratory failure caused by the seasonal flu in the US every year. But the vast majority of people infected make a full and complete recovery.
Tissue tropism is a big deal. When a virus invades a cell, it replicates within the cell, and at a certain point, the cell bursts releasing the virus into surrounding cells. Multiply this a few million times, and you can see why viruses cause damage and pain. The respiratory tracts of healthy people are prepared for this, capable of withstanding substantial damage and replacing destroyed cells with new ones. Our digestive tracts are also very capable of sloughing off damaged cells and replacing them with healthy ones (although the process is never a pleasant one for obvious reasons). Brain tissue, however, is not prepared for this. Those who recover from brain infections invariably will have permanent neurological damage, which, depending on the part of the brain infected, might result in cognitive impairment, loss of motor skills, seizures, etc. Nasty, nasty stuff.
But this is in ferrets, so what's the big deal with regards to humans, right? Apparently -- and I only recently discovered this while reading an article in the Journal of Virology (http://jvi.asm.org) -- ferrets are an excellent model for human influenza studies. The authors of the article I read intranasally inoculated ferrets with four human isolates of H5N1, as well as nine avian and domestic chicken isolates. Seven of the avian isolates (i.e., viruses taken directly from infected birds) caused only mild infections in ferrets, and all virus replication was restricted to the upper respiratory tract. All four human isolates, as well as two of the avian isolates, caused lethal systemic infections (involving multiple organs, including neurotropism) in ferrets.
I doubt many of you have heard this reported by the mainstream press. Their focus seems to be on the high mortality rate of H5N1 infections in humans overall, as if "avian flu" is a distinct disease with uniform symptoms. It's anything but. I'm finding out there are several different isolates (strains) of H5N1 in circulation, some causing mild infections and others causing lethal systemic infections in mammals. As of the time of that article (late 2004), the molecular basis for the increased virulence of these H5N1 viruses is unresolved, i.e., they don't know why some H5N1 isolates produce mild symptoms and others are lethal. They also don't know how many different strains are currently in circulation. They keep finding new ones emerging in wild bird populations.
Which of these H5N1 strains will make the jump to a pandemic human influenza strain? Unknown.
I apologize if I'm rambling on this. Probably not the best forum for such discussions. I can send links to some of the scientific articles I've found to anyone who's interested. You can contact me via email (my address is my full name, without the space between first and last, at gmail.com).
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
My Two Cents:
First off thanks for letting me know you enjoyed my piece.
No matter what's happening around us, we still need to have a laugh.
And I got a good laugh from you as well over your "Keeper of the Grammar" comment. Hahahaha...
I do find it distrubing that my Blog was not even UP NINETY seconds before one of the "Anonymous" family happily pounced on a typo and a careless grammatical mistake I made as an excuse to ridicule me. It doesn't bother me much for myself, but it is a symptom and type of behavior that is a sign of the times.
Some venom and hate are alive and well on the Cape, but hopefully we can still work around it and provide some alternatives to it.
We here are STILL, all in all, in better shape than a lot of the rest of the country when it comes to intolerance.
Some of what we see here is probably teen "angst." The need to lash out immaturely and innapropriately for attention, instead of learning how to use words (that he seens to be able to spell), in useful discussion.
But, sadly, there are also some adults out there who use harassment of others to bolster their own bad self images. By finding fault with others it seems to make them feel more important than they obviously are in life (Ya want fries with that burger?).
It is a shame that anyone with enough education to correct my blog in 90 seconds, is not spending their time using their knowledge constructively.
And as for Cape people thinking they are immune. It is not exclusive to us.
My "Floridian" father wasn't worried a bit about hurricane Wilma on Sunday.
He was sure it would never touch him. Well, as it turned out, at age 85, he ended up having his first encounter of the "scary kind" when Wilma paid him an unexpected visit. He's OK, but I don't think dad will ever feel the same about hurricanes again.
And so it is with pandemics too.
It just sometimes takes a good scare to make people realize how vulnerable they really are, AND that the government doesn't really give a damn.
Good to hear from you again.
First off thanks for letting me know you enjoyed my piece.
No matter what's happening around us, we still need to have a laugh.
And I got a good laugh from you as well over your "Keeper of the Grammar" comment. Hahahaha...
I do find it distrubing that my Blog was not even UP NINETY seconds before one of the "Anonymous" family happily pounced on a typo and a careless grammatical mistake I made as an excuse to ridicule me. It doesn't bother me much for myself, but it is a symptom and type of behavior that is a sign of the times.
Some venom and hate are alive and well on the Cape, but hopefully we can still work around it and provide some alternatives to it.
We here are STILL, all in all, in better shape than a lot of the rest of the country when it comes to intolerance.
Some of what we see here is probably teen "angst." The need to lash out immaturely and innapropriately for attention, instead of learning how to use words (that he seens to be able to spell), in useful discussion.
But, sadly, there are also some adults out there who use harassment of others to bolster their own bad self images. By finding fault with others it seems to make them feel more important than they obviously are in life (Ya want fries with that burger?).
It is a shame that anyone with enough education to correct my blog in 90 seconds, is not spending their time using their knowledge constructively.
And as for Cape people thinking they are immune. It is not exclusive to us.
My "Floridian" father wasn't worried a bit about hurricane Wilma on Sunday.
He was sure it would never touch him. Well, as it turned out, at age 85, he ended up having his first encounter of the "scary kind" when Wilma paid him an unexpected visit. He's OK, but I don't think dad will ever feel the same about hurricanes again.
And so it is with pandemics too.
It just sometimes takes a good scare to make people realize how vulnerable they really are, AND that the government doesn't really give a damn.
Good to hear from you again.
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
A Favor?
Can all of you Anonymous people at least number yourselves so we can all keep clear which phantom I am speaking to? TY.
To one of them:
We usually don't get our drugs from Europe. We usually get them from Canada. Only the drug manufacturers (and their political puppets (who get big bucks for their election campaigns) are the ones saying Canada has inferior drugs.
BUT, Canadian drugs should not be confused with buying drugs over the internet. THAT is still dangerous.
TWO Cents is right too.
Kiwi:
Subject matter and "PC" has nothing to do with deleting comments here.
If you will scroll up, you will see that I just don't want this space filled with profanity.
Anyone that uses it, will have their comment removed. So far I've removed a "Pro" comment, and a "Con" comment. I don't discriminate. And I don't like losing the comments either, but, since this IS my blog, I have every right to ask that "hard" profanity not be used.
There are enough regular words and slang as well as punctuation to get ANY point across.
Also: No outright HATE speeches will be allowed, as well as actual personal attacks against anyone here (especially if they include racial and religious slurs).
Disagreements are part of debate and discussion, and can be fruitful.
But we can still stay on the fringes of "civil" by intellectually bashing each other with facts and opinions.
As for your current comments on the flu Kiwi:
I completey agree with you.
The US, as I mentioned in my Blog, is far down on the waiting list for antiviral because of thinking once more that a HUGE disease was "Over there" and not our problem.
The same thinking we had when Reagan was in office and AIDS was decimating Africa and Haiti (and Gay people at home).
Hey, it took bombing Hawaii to get us into World War 2!
I don't think it absurd at all to think that the filthy rich and powerful of many nations think of "Thinning the herd" now and then. Disease is a good way. So are troops without enough gear to protect them.
Come on back and visit again. Sorry for any misunderstandings.
Can all of you Anonymous people at least number yourselves so we can all keep clear which phantom I am speaking to? TY.
To one of them:
We usually don't get our drugs from Europe. We usually get them from Canada. Only the drug manufacturers (and their political puppets (who get big bucks for their election campaigns) are the ones saying Canada has inferior drugs.
BUT, Canadian drugs should not be confused with buying drugs over the internet. THAT is still dangerous.
TWO Cents is right too.
Kiwi:
Subject matter and "PC" has nothing to do with deleting comments here.
If you will scroll up, you will see that I just don't want this space filled with profanity.
Anyone that uses it, will have their comment removed. So far I've removed a "Pro" comment, and a "Con" comment. I don't discriminate. And I don't like losing the comments either, but, since this IS my blog, I have every right to ask that "hard" profanity not be used.
There are enough regular words and slang as well as punctuation to get ANY point across.
Also: No outright HATE speeches will be allowed, as well as actual personal attacks against anyone here (especially if they include racial and religious slurs).
Disagreements are part of debate and discussion, and can be fruitful.
But we can still stay on the fringes of "civil" by intellectually bashing each other with facts and opinions.
As for your current comments on the flu Kiwi:
I completey agree with you.
The US, as I mentioned in my Blog, is far down on the waiting list for antiviral because of thinking once more that a HUGE disease was "Over there" and not our problem.
The same thinking we had when Reagan was in office and AIDS was decimating Africa and Haiti (and Gay people at home).
Hey, it took bombing Hawaii to get us into World War 2!
I don't think it absurd at all to think that the filthy rich and powerful of many nations think of "Thinning the herd" now and then. Disease is a good way. So are troops without enough gear to protect them.
Come on back and visit again. Sorry for any misunderstandings.
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
Sean:
The very fact that someone with your background is here, discussing H5N1 with the rest of us gives me great satisfaction.
Although I often pepper even serious things with humor in my ramblings (it tends to make more people with ADD sit still longer...joke, joke...), I usually try and pick subjects that I think need to be talked about.
When that happens, I feel I have done a good job.
I agree with you that panic is not the answer.
Like you, I also think people just need to be more aware.
Especially with all the birds we have on Cape Cod.
Your suggestions of where to get even MORE information helps us all.
Thanks for your input on a very important subject.
Stop by again.
The very fact that someone with your background is here, discussing H5N1 with the rest of us gives me great satisfaction.
Although I often pepper even serious things with humor in my ramblings (it tends to make more people with ADD sit still longer...joke, joke...), I usually try and pick subjects that I think need to be talked about.
When that happens, I feel I have done a good job.
I agree with you that panic is not the answer.
Like you, I also think people just need to be more aware.
Especially with all the birds we have on Cape Cod.
Your suggestions of where to get even MORE information helps us all.
Thanks for your input on a very important subject.
Stop by again.
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
Drew:
As you would say, "You had me ... up to a point."
Yes, we all need to listen and learn. About a lot of things.
But, having read a bit already on this subject, and seeing the disregard our Federal Governement has shown when it comes to protecting us from AIDS, Floods, Hurricanes and other life threatening situations, I still have very serious doubts they will come through for us on the upcoming pandemic.
"Politicizing a flu outbreak that has not yet occurred is pathetic," you said.
Everything important is politically involved if you need action. And, as Mr. Cavanaugh said, this flu is a pretty sure bet ... and this nation is FAR from prepared to deal with millions of people falling over in the streets.
That may sound dramatic to you, but, again, go read about the 1918 flu pandemic. That is exactly what happened.
To call attention to this, and wonder what our Government is going to do about it, is not a "Diversion" Drew, but a necessity!
Protocol? Sure. But I have seen none yet in Washington.
We need to be making plans now for what is ahead. Not ignoring it.
And furthermore, You come here often enough to disagree with me to know i don't "Pull" comments based on a protocol of opinion. The only two posts every removed were due to profanity. And those folks are more than welcome to clean it up and put it back.
You ARE a flame thrower aren't you?
Another word you use is "Pathetic." That is a word i would use for our current Administration, and their efforts to thwart this coming sickness.
They are so wrapped up in themselves (especially their own legal problems now), their friends, their obligations to their corporate "backers," and making sure they get all their "agenda" pushed through before a Democrat gets his hands on the Oval office again that our voices and health mean nothing to them.
If you think you mean a thing to George Bush, other than as a potential "Grunt" on the front line (if you are uner 40), you have a wake up call coming.
And today the nation celebrated a MILESTONE: Our 2,000th soldier has died.
One thing you do have right Drew: The Wildlife people are watching this situation very carefully ...and DESPITE the fact that they have lost a lot of money, staff and tools due to cuts from Bush and the Beltway Boys!
PS Drew: You think we have money to spare in Washington? What stats have you been reading? Bush came into office with the LARGEST budget surplus in our history, and has now put us in the HIGHEST DEFICIT in our nations history.
And you think we have enough money?
As we speak Bush is negotiating LOANS from China of all places, as well as from other countries.
Experts agree we are on the verge of inflation..and that is usually followed by a recession.
Home sales have slowed, utilities and food have doubled in price and natural and man made disasters are hitting us left and right.
And you support tax cuts for Donald trump?
Do you live at home by any chance? When was the last time you bought some pork chops?
Amazing.....
As you would say, "You had me ... up to a point."
Yes, we all need to listen and learn. About a lot of things.
But, having read a bit already on this subject, and seeing the disregard our Federal Governement has shown when it comes to protecting us from AIDS, Floods, Hurricanes and other life threatening situations, I still have very serious doubts they will come through for us on the upcoming pandemic.
"Politicizing a flu outbreak that has not yet occurred is pathetic," you said.
Everything important is politically involved if you need action. And, as Mr. Cavanaugh said, this flu is a pretty sure bet ... and this nation is FAR from prepared to deal with millions of people falling over in the streets.
That may sound dramatic to you, but, again, go read about the 1918 flu pandemic. That is exactly what happened.
To call attention to this, and wonder what our Government is going to do about it, is not a "Diversion" Drew, but a necessity!
Protocol? Sure. But I have seen none yet in Washington.
We need to be making plans now for what is ahead. Not ignoring it.
And furthermore, You come here often enough to disagree with me to know i don't "Pull" comments based on a protocol of opinion. The only two posts every removed were due to profanity. And those folks are more than welcome to clean it up and put it back.
You ARE a flame thrower aren't you?
Another word you use is "Pathetic." That is a word i would use for our current Administration, and their efforts to thwart this coming sickness.
They are so wrapped up in themselves (especially their own legal problems now), their friends, their obligations to their corporate "backers," and making sure they get all their "agenda" pushed through before a Democrat gets his hands on the Oval office again that our voices and health mean nothing to them.
If you think you mean a thing to George Bush, other than as a potential "Grunt" on the front line (if you are uner 40), you have a wake up call coming.
And today the nation celebrated a MILESTONE: Our 2,000th soldier has died.
One thing you do have right Drew: The Wildlife people are watching this situation very carefully ...and DESPITE the fact that they have lost a lot of money, staff and tools due to cuts from Bush and the Beltway Boys!
PS Drew: You think we have money to spare in Washington? What stats have you been reading? Bush came into office with the LARGEST budget surplus in our history, and has now put us in the HIGHEST DEFICIT in our nations history.
And you think we have enough money?
As we speak Bush is negotiating LOANS from China of all places, as well as from other countries.
Experts agree we are on the verge of inflation..and that is usually followed by a recession.
Home sales have slowed, utilities and food have doubled in price and natural and man made disasters are hitting us left and right.
And you support tax cuts for Donald trump?
Do you live at home by any chance? When was the last time you bought some pork chops?
Amazing.....
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
El Greco:
LOL. Thanks for the laughs.
I just may pour myself a little Wild stuff tonight.
Hmmm... Maybe we can marinate the Thanksgiving Turkey in it.
You might be really on to something there!
Watch These Birds:
Although you are very welcome here, I think you made a wrong turn at Blog Chowder.
The Wind Farm Blog is the one right before this one.
We are talking about SICK birds and Avian Flu here, not windmill hacked birds.
But, please feel free to stop by anytime.
AvianFluFish:
Yes, somoene already mentioned using the windmills as tools against birds ...about thirteen comments ago. And, incidentally, the fish have enough problems of their own.
You try being a fish in one of the disappearing estuaries on the cape, swimming in mercury, Pcb's, raw sewage and oxygen starved water filled with algae.
Yup, we got the fish covered already.
Kiwi:
You said, "Is it any wonder the world is fighting back!"
Not to me.
I quoted Kurt Vonnegut here a few blogs ago. He was out promoting his new book on TV when he said, "The Earths' immune system is trying everything to get rid of us."
Makes perfect sense to me.
Go back and read a few of my blogs (July/August) and see that I have spent countless hours writing about the Overbuilding of Cape Cod and how it is killing our environment.
Before Katrina even hit New Orleans I was complaining about all the "Trophy Homes" and condos being built on marshes and wetlands here on Cape. How we will be open and defenseless to the elements and high rising water without protective barrier lands.
Those out of town 40B developers have caused me to wince for a long time now.
They just toss them up, with no thought to sewage problems in our towns and then head home to Andover, or Ct. or Newport or wherever. Not here!
The nitrogen from these units septic systems are already killing fish and the most Codders are already drinking bottled water themselves.
Mashpee had the biggest fishkill in its history this summer.
Stick around. I like you.
LOL. Thanks for the laughs.
I just may pour myself a little Wild stuff tonight.
Hmmm... Maybe we can marinate the Thanksgiving Turkey in it.
You might be really on to something there!
Watch These Birds:
Although you are very welcome here, I think you made a wrong turn at Blog Chowder.
The Wind Farm Blog is the one right before this one.
We are talking about SICK birds and Avian Flu here, not windmill hacked birds.
But, please feel free to stop by anytime.
AvianFluFish:
Yes, somoene already mentioned using the windmills as tools against birds ...about thirteen comments ago. And, incidentally, the fish have enough problems of their own.
You try being a fish in one of the disappearing estuaries on the cape, swimming in mercury, Pcb's, raw sewage and oxygen starved water filled with algae.
Yup, we got the fish covered already.
Kiwi:
You said, "Is it any wonder the world is fighting back!"
Not to me.
I quoted Kurt Vonnegut here a few blogs ago. He was out promoting his new book on TV when he said, "The Earths' immune system is trying everything to get rid of us."
Makes perfect sense to me.
Go back and read a few of my blogs (July/August) and see that I have spent countless hours writing about the Overbuilding of Cape Cod and how it is killing our environment.
Before Katrina even hit New Orleans I was complaining about all the "Trophy Homes" and condos being built on marshes and wetlands here on Cape. How we will be open and defenseless to the elements and high rising water without protective barrier lands.
Those out of town 40B developers have caused me to wince for a long time now.
They just toss them up, with no thought to sewage problems in our towns and then head home to Andover, or Ct. or Newport or wherever. Not here!
The nitrogen from these units septic systems are already killing fish and the most Codders are already drinking bottled water themselves.
Mashpee had the biggest fishkill in its history this summer.
Stick around. I like you.
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
Sean:
It seems mutation is doing a fine job spreading this new flu in many directions.
Interspecies flu happened with those pigs a few years back too (Swine flu), but the neurological aspects you speak of are indeed alarming.
Pneumonia is a big worry with this flu, espeically when no antibiotics can keep it in the upper respiratory tracts. Only bacertial pneumonia shots are even available to people now ...not any kind of viral one, even for viruses we know.
Interstingly, the new OTC drug for humans, that the FDA approved about 2-3 years ago called VIACAM, was created to keep viruses in the sinus area and not to let them drop down to the lungs etc.
I have been usng it myself (when I first feel a cold coming on, and find it works remarkably well).
Wouldn't it be wonderful if they could find a derivative of that form of treatment for this bug?
Reading your words makes me think that the RELENZA drug I mentioned in my blog (the one to be inhaled or injected) might be based on that same idea. Hmmm....
I subscribe to a handful of emerging infectious disease newsletters, and try and keep up on more than the newsstand press on a lot disease (check my past blogs). But, you seem to be an expert in molecular biology...something I never got to as life got in the way.
But I have heard of varying strains of the H5N1...and, as I said in my last article, it seems to be the N1 part that is really baffling the scientists. They are having a tough time getting a handle on it, and as a result, we have to wait for a vaccine because of all the mutations.
We need money for treatment as well as vaccines. Some new antivirals too would be great!
Thanks for the input.
Stop by some more. We can always use updates.
It seems mutation is doing a fine job spreading this new flu in many directions.
Interspecies flu happened with those pigs a few years back too (Swine flu), but the neurological aspects you speak of are indeed alarming.
Pneumonia is a big worry with this flu, espeically when no antibiotics can keep it in the upper respiratory tracts. Only bacertial pneumonia shots are even available to people now ...not any kind of viral one, even for viruses we know.
Interstingly, the new OTC drug for humans, that the FDA approved about 2-3 years ago called VIACAM, was created to keep viruses in the sinus area and not to let them drop down to the lungs etc.
I have been usng it myself (when I first feel a cold coming on, and find it works remarkably well).
Wouldn't it be wonderful if they could find a derivative of that form of treatment for this bug?
Reading your words makes me think that the RELENZA drug I mentioned in my blog (the one to be inhaled or injected) might be based on that same idea. Hmmm....
I subscribe to a handful of emerging infectious disease newsletters, and try and keep up on more than the newsstand press on a lot disease (check my past blogs). But, you seem to be an expert in molecular biology...something I never got to as life got in the way.
But I have heard of varying strains of the H5N1...and, as I said in my last article, it seems to be the N1 part that is really baffling the scientists. They are having a tough time getting a handle on it, and as a result, we have to wait for a vaccine because of all the mutations.
We need money for treatment as well as vaccines. Some new antivirals too would be great!
Thanks for the input.
Stop by some more. We can always use updates.
Kiwi [Visitor] writes:
JC "no worries mate" as we say in the antipodes.My only mistake was to focus on the grammar dude who dissed you.
Down here in New Zealand we have very similar issues with government and social responsibility. Same stuff just less zeros on the bills.
Part of the problem i see with the western world, and I include NZ in this, is our blind belief that somehow the government has the fix it pill for all the ills.
Social and moral responsibility seems to be decreasing rapidly and this applies to any pandemic or global catastrophy.
Expecting the choppers to arrive and airlift you to safety cause you chose to ignore the warnings to leave or expecting the sniffer dogs tents and heavy machinery to arrive teleported instantly to assist you is a very dangerous and naive mentality to have.
"Be prepared" is the old boy scout moto and if that means having 7-14 days food fuel/portable gen and water on hand for just such eventualities (and probably a large riot shot gun if ya live in USA ) is not just apocalyptic thinking but probably an essential part of everyones kit.
Unfortunately with the virus air borne transmissions we dont have any other means of staying safe other than isolation rubber gloves and masks all of which proved pretty effective through SARS and other outbreaks.
Simple things like cleaning your hands, not shaking hands with strangers (and without being howard hughes here, I never shake hands at a BBQ or before i eat food... ya should see how many men leave the washroom without a scrub up!!!) These are simple steps anyone can take to prevent catching any bugs.
Nature has and always will be the most powerful force in our little world and the sooner people realise this the better.
I am sure the people on the titanic or the bravest astronauts thought technology gave them the edge over the world, and every year i am still amazed at the people that rebuild houses on flood plains, beachfronts, amongst tinder dry mountain bush or without a storm cellar in the tornado zone, and the culpability of the govt officials who saction the idiocy of permiting this.
we have the means & money now within the world to make this place an eden, however like all good ideas mans ability to always want more & more wealth and status simply means there will always be someone out who wants to be the overdog.
Without sounding like some rabid socialist, true egalatarian society will not develop until man is taught from the cradle that all of us are in the lifeboat together and that every single one of us has the the right to clean water, shelter, and the riches of the world.
I despair that people can earn millions of dollars and think that this is somehow a status worth celebrating, bill gates alone is pondering the complexities of disposing of $6 billion dollars every year for the next decade to alleviate his guilt at being the worlds wealthiest man.
We live in world were the person who seems to have the most vapid of life styles eg actors and actresses or rap stars singing about killing and whoring are fetted and lorded as an ideal to aspire to.
When will the eco warriors or green peace or the mother teresas of this world reach this pinacle of cultural desirability... probably never, we as humans need our little caveman brains to catch up with our technology very soon cause we are very surely making the plane a living death for all the creatures that exist no only ourselves.
In short nothing will change till we change ourselves and our thinking, and ask how much do i really need, happiness CANT be bought people, and you won't find it at the pharmacy either!.
Down here in New Zealand we have very similar issues with government and social responsibility. Same stuff just less zeros on the bills.
Part of the problem i see with the western world, and I include NZ in this, is our blind belief that somehow the government has the fix it pill for all the ills.
Social and moral responsibility seems to be decreasing rapidly and this applies to any pandemic or global catastrophy.
Expecting the choppers to arrive and airlift you to safety cause you chose to ignore the warnings to leave or expecting the sniffer dogs tents and heavy machinery to arrive teleported instantly to assist you is a very dangerous and naive mentality to have.
"Be prepared" is the old boy scout moto and if that means having 7-14 days food fuel/portable gen and water on hand for just such eventualities (and probably a large riot shot gun if ya live in USA ) is not just apocalyptic thinking but probably an essential part of everyones kit.
Unfortunately with the virus air borne transmissions we dont have any other means of staying safe other than isolation rubber gloves and masks all of which proved pretty effective through SARS and other outbreaks.
Simple things like cleaning your hands, not shaking hands with strangers (and without being howard hughes here, I never shake hands at a BBQ or before i eat food... ya should see how many men leave the washroom without a scrub up!!!) These are simple steps anyone can take to prevent catching any bugs.
Nature has and always will be the most powerful force in our little world and the sooner people realise this the better.
I am sure the people on the titanic or the bravest astronauts thought technology gave them the edge over the world, and every year i am still amazed at the people that rebuild houses on flood plains, beachfronts, amongst tinder dry mountain bush or without a storm cellar in the tornado zone, and the culpability of the govt officials who saction the idiocy of permiting this.
we have the means & money now within the world to make this place an eden, however like all good ideas mans ability to always want more & more wealth and status simply means there will always be someone out who wants to be the overdog.
Without sounding like some rabid socialist, true egalatarian society will not develop until man is taught from the cradle that all of us are in the lifeboat together and that every single one of us has the the right to clean water, shelter, and the riches of the world.
I despair that people can earn millions of dollars and think that this is somehow a status worth celebrating, bill gates alone is pondering the complexities of disposing of $6 billion dollars every year for the next decade to alleviate his guilt at being the worlds wealthiest man.
We live in world were the person who seems to have the most vapid of life styles eg actors and actresses or rap stars singing about killing and whoring are fetted and lorded as an ideal to aspire to.
When will the eco warriors or green peace or the mother teresas of this world reach this pinacle of cultural desirability... probably never, we as humans need our little caveman brains to catch up with our technology very soon cause we are very surely making the plane a living death for all the creatures that exist no only ourselves.
In short nothing will change till we change ourselves and our thinking, and ask how much do i really need, happiness CANT be bought people, and you won't find it at the pharmacy either!.
Sean Cavanaugh [Visitor] writes:
JC, yes, anti-viral drugs like Relenza (zanamivir) may prove helpful not only therapeutically (after the onset of symptoms), but when used as a prophylaxis may prevent infection (or lower one's chances).
Unfortunately (and I hate to keep bringing up bad news), H5N1 strains have emerged that are resistant to anti-viral drugs. One in particular, Amantadine (and its derivative rimantadine) are essentially off the list of effective drugs now, thanks in large part to illegal use of the drugs by the Chinese government. They administered the drug in chicken feed -- in flagrant violation of international law -- and in a very short amount of time, amantadine-resistant strains of H5N1 emerged. Now virtually all of them are amantadine-resistant.
Another drug I'm sure you've heard of, Tamiflu (oseltamivir), is considered our best bet in terms of anti-viral drugs. But in February of 2005, an H5N1 virus isolated from a 14-year old Vietnamese girl was found to be resistant to oseltamivir. It's the only case of oseltamivir-resistance so far, but how much longer will it be before more resistance to oseltamivir occurs? It seems pretty apparent that governments will need to start stockpiling zanamivir as well as oseltamivir (and let's hope certain countries don't start using zanamivir too soon).
Vaccines are a really tough issue right now. The current H5N1 strains are 100% lethal to chickens and chicken embryos, so we can't even start work on a vaccine at present. But even if we could, there's no indication it would be of any use. From what I understand, before an effective vaccine can be developed, a human form of H5N1 will have to emerge. That hasn't happened yet. H5N1 is still very much an animal disease, and even though humans are susceptible to it, we're not carriers or hosts of the virus, i.e., we can't spread it to others.
A likely scenario that will change all this occurs when a human infected with the avian H5N1 virus becomes infected with a seasonal flu virus. The H5N1 virus then picks up genetic code from the human flu virus and a new, pandemic strain emerges. At that point, we can start work on an effective vaccine, but it will take several months.
Aside from the drugs and vaccines, we need to get boots on the ground in countries where the avian flu outbreaks are occurring, identifying and isolating human cases as soon as possible. I mean, every human case of H5N1 needs to be treated as a potential global threat, even more so now that the epidemic flu season is starting to unfold. Many of these Asian countries don't have the resources, money and expertise to deal with it on their own.
PS: Yeah, it's a serious issue, but it's not like it couldn't use some seasonings of humor. Keep that up. I enjoy your blog, and sometimes you just have to shake things up a bit.
Unfortunately (and I hate to keep bringing up bad news), H5N1 strains have emerged that are resistant to anti-viral drugs. One in particular, Amantadine (and its derivative rimantadine) are essentially off the list of effective drugs now, thanks in large part to illegal use of the drugs by the Chinese government. They administered the drug in chicken feed -- in flagrant violation of international law -- and in a very short amount of time, amantadine-resistant strains of H5N1 emerged. Now virtually all of them are amantadine-resistant.
Another drug I'm sure you've heard of, Tamiflu (oseltamivir), is considered our best bet in terms of anti-viral drugs. But in February of 2005, an H5N1 virus isolated from a 14-year old Vietnamese girl was found to be resistant to oseltamivir. It's the only case of oseltamivir-resistance so far, but how much longer will it be before more resistance to oseltamivir occurs? It seems pretty apparent that governments will need to start stockpiling zanamivir as well as oseltamivir (and let's hope certain countries don't start using zanamivir too soon).
Vaccines are a really tough issue right now. The current H5N1 strains are 100% lethal to chickens and chicken embryos, so we can't even start work on a vaccine at present. But even if we could, there's no indication it would be of any use. From what I understand, before an effective vaccine can be developed, a human form of H5N1 will have to emerge. That hasn't happened yet. H5N1 is still very much an animal disease, and even though humans are susceptible to it, we're not carriers or hosts of the virus, i.e., we can't spread it to others.
A likely scenario that will change all this occurs when a human infected with the avian H5N1 virus becomes infected with a seasonal flu virus. The H5N1 virus then picks up genetic code from the human flu virus and a new, pandemic strain emerges. At that point, we can start work on an effective vaccine, but it will take several months.
Aside from the drugs and vaccines, we need to get boots on the ground in countries where the avian flu outbreaks are occurring, identifying and isolating human cases as soon as possible. I mean, every human case of H5N1 needs to be treated as a potential global threat, even more so now that the epidemic flu season is starting to unfold. Many of these Asian countries don't have the resources, money and expertise to deal with it on their own.
PS: Yeah, it's a serious issue, but it's not like it couldn't use some seasonings of humor. Keep that up. I enjoy your blog, and sometimes you just have to shake things up a bit.
Hog Wild [Visitor] writes:
Thanks JC, I agree with what you write. Is the flu issue serious; you bet! When I was twelve years old in '57 I had gone on a shopping trip with several friends. We were waiting for a bus to return to home when I felt terrible, then woosie...lightheaded...with a pounding headache. I began to slide down the building that I had been leaning against (so they tell me.) I awoke 5 days later in Boston City Hospital with 2 doctors and several nurses in my room. They welcomed me back to the land of the living and told me that they thought that I wouldn't make it....that the flu had taken almost every inch of life out of me. One of the girls that I had been with had died 2 days after she had gotten to the hospital. Do I feel blessed that I had made it....you bet! It took 2 months for me to regain my strength and go back to school! Now that was just a regular flu...I was a healthy 12 year old....and we hadn't beaten our medicines to death with over use...and the avian flu is 5 times as leathal. So fasten your seat belts folks...and listen intently...it looks like we're in for a bumpy ride! And if you're not to lame brained, get after your REPS and Senators to get busy on this issue!!!! (they are on vacation too many times anyway.)
Doc [Visitor] writes:
Anonymous writes:
1 word: PARANOID Anonymous....I suppose there's no global warming either; but then it must be hard suffering with the "Monkey Syndrone" " Hear no evil,See no evil,Speak no evil." You are nuts!
1 word: PARANOID Anonymous....I suppose there's no global warming either; but then it must be hard suffering with the "Monkey Syndrone" " Hear no evil,See no evil,Speak no evil." You are nuts!
Sean Cavanaugh [Visitor] writes:
Re: the Kurt Vonnegut comment, Richard Preston said pretty much the same thing in The Hot Zone, that the emergence of certain viruses might be akin to the earth's immune system combatting an extreme amplification of the human species. I don't necessarily think that's the case, although I don't reject the idea either.
The other day as I was discussing influenza with a good friend, I made a comment something along the lines that the virus is "experimenting," trying out new forms or prototypes to see which one is best-suited for mass production and distribution to a world-wide market.
My friend accused me of anthropomorphizing the virus. I agreed with him that I was probably guilty, although both of us could see that such analogies can be useful in understanding the evolutionary process.
Then I started thinking about it a bit more and wondered, why do we view viruses, the influenza virus in particular, as something external, something that is somehow not us? It IS us. It's our own RNA, with bits and pieces borrowed from certain species of birds, or from some of our mammalian cousins. Unlike, say, bacteria, influenza cannot exist without us. And yet we persist in viewing it as not us, as if influenza were in the same class as meteors, locusts, the plague, or some other "foreign" invasion force.
I think most of us can see evolution in action when we study viruses, but again, we tend to view it as a process separate from us. Perhaps viruses are important agents of our own evolution, not "our" as in simply humans, but the evolution of all lifeforms. Who knows, maybe an RNA world preceded the DNA world, and we're the product of that development...
Anyway, I think this view is more interesting than the one Vonnegut and Preston offer, which in many ways is just another "war" analogy -- in this case immunological combat -- where humans are always separate and distinct from everything else. When we buy into the "War on [fill in the blank]" worldview, eradication becomes the ultimate goal, and that's just not going to happen. It's unrealistic, and it doesn't whether the war is on drugs, terrorism, crime, disease, whatever.
Just like some people ask, "What killed the dinosaurs?" my response is always, who said they were killed? They're flying around right now, chirping, singing songs, building nests, migrating around the globe, reproducing and evolving just as they always have. Oh, and of course acting as the natural host for all Type A influenza viruses. Natch.
;-)
The other day as I was discussing influenza with a good friend, I made a comment something along the lines that the virus is "experimenting," trying out new forms or prototypes to see which one is best-suited for mass production and distribution to a world-wide market.
My friend accused me of anthropomorphizing the virus. I agreed with him that I was probably guilty, although both of us could see that such analogies can be useful in understanding the evolutionary process.
Then I started thinking about it a bit more and wondered, why do we view viruses, the influenza virus in particular, as something external, something that is somehow not us? It IS us. It's our own RNA, with bits and pieces borrowed from certain species of birds, or from some of our mammalian cousins. Unlike, say, bacteria, influenza cannot exist without us. And yet we persist in viewing it as not us, as if influenza were in the same class as meteors, locusts, the plague, or some other "foreign" invasion force.
I think most of us can see evolution in action when we study viruses, but again, we tend to view it as a process separate from us. Perhaps viruses are important agents of our own evolution, not "our" as in simply humans, but the evolution of all lifeforms. Who knows, maybe an RNA world preceded the DNA world, and we're the product of that development...
Anyway, I think this view is more interesting than the one Vonnegut and Preston offer, which in many ways is just another "war" analogy -- in this case immunological combat -- where humans are always separate and distinct from everything else. When we buy into the "War on [fill in the blank]" worldview, eradication becomes the ultimate goal, and that's just not going to happen. It's unrealistic, and it doesn't whether the war is on drugs, terrorism, crime, disease, whatever.
Just like some people ask, "What killed the dinosaurs?" my response is always, who said they were killed? They're flying around right now, chirping, singing songs, building nests, migrating around the globe, reproducing and evolving just as they always have. Oh, and of course acting as the natural host for all Type A influenza viruses. Natch.
;-)
Kiwi [Visitor] writes:
Given that researchers are now turning to bacteria to cure anything from bad breath (NZ development of Bliss) to stomach cancer, mans persistant efforts to eradicate disease seems fairly likely to fail.
Given the life span of a virus or bacteria is so quick with maybe a million? mutations and a huge gene pool to draw from man has little hope of beating these things by the old slash and burn technique.
Part of the problem is as sean says the govt and farmers using antibiotics or viral medications in feed stocks.
This is prevelent in fish farming, sheep and dairy, and the poultry industry to name a few.
Where does this lead us in a few years? Not only in animals natural immunity but our own health and combative drugs being unavailable simply because of irresponsible useage.
JC you state "Interstingly, the new OTC drugfor humans, that the FDA approved about 2-3 years ago called VIACAM, was created to keep viruses in the sinus area and not to let them drop down to the lungs etc.
I have been usng it myself (when I first feel a cold coming on, and find it works remarkably well)."
Well come on man whats wrong with eucalyptis oil in a bowl of hot water, or some honey or propalis or vicks cough lollies or good old chicken soup!
When we rush for drugs to treat every little sniffle we defeat our bodies amazing immune systems attempts to develop antibodies and harm our resistance to thes germs.
drugs should only be a last resort not a first port of call.
That way when you really need em they work!
I think we need to live in concert with these bugs and isolate the friendly ones to fight the bad ones, use nature to fight nature, not try to destroy nature with man made chemical weaponry.
Given the life span of a virus or bacteria is so quick with maybe a million? mutations and a huge gene pool to draw from man has little hope of beating these things by the old slash and burn technique.
Part of the problem is as sean says the govt and farmers using antibiotics or viral medications in feed stocks.
This is prevelent in fish farming, sheep and dairy, and the poultry industry to name a few.
Where does this lead us in a few years? Not only in animals natural immunity but our own health and combative drugs being unavailable simply because of irresponsible useage.
JC you state "Interstingly, the new OTC drugfor humans, that the FDA approved about 2-3 years ago called VIACAM, was created to keep viruses in the sinus area and not to let them drop down to the lungs etc.
I have been usng it myself (when I first feel a cold coming on, and find it works remarkably well)."
Well come on man whats wrong with eucalyptis oil in a bowl of hot water, or some honey or propalis or vicks cough lollies or good old chicken soup!
When we rush for drugs to treat every little sniffle we defeat our bodies amazing immune systems attempts to develop antibodies and harm our resistance to thes germs.
drugs should only be a last resort not a first port of call.
That way when you really need em they work!
I think we need to live in concert with these bugs and isolate the friendly ones to fight the bad ones, use nature to fight nature, not try to destroy nature with man made chemical weaponry.
Sean Cavanaugh [Visitor] writes:
Kiwi, what you say makes a lot of sense. Sometimes I wonder if the world would be a better place if we controlled antibiotics and antiviral drugs instead of narcotics. I mean, non-prescription use of the latter can certainly be dangerous to the individual, but non-prescription use of the former, or partial/irregular use even with a prescription, is dangerous to society, to mankind in general.
I do, however, make a distinction between "antibiotic" and "anti-bacterial." The former poses the very real threat of promoting resistant strains. The latter is merely a marketing term for "antiseptic." Plain old soap and hot water is "anti-bacterial," whether or not the soap manufacturer uses that term on the label. These gelled-alcohol preparations you see (e.g., Purell) are antiseptic preparations that do not promote resistance either. Bleach, rubbing alcohol, iodine solutions, etc., are all useful antiseptics as well.
I do, however, make a distinction between "antibiotic" and "anti-bacterial." The former poses the very real threat of promoting resistant strains. The latter is merely a marketing term for "antiseptic." Plain old soap and hot water is "anti-bacterial," whether or not the soap manufacturer uses that term on the label. These gelled-alcohol preparations you see (e.g., Purell) are antiseptic preparations that do not promote resistance either. Bleach, rubbing alcohol, iodine solutions, etc., are all useful antiseptics as well.
Kiwi [Visitor] writes:
Sean true just couple of days ago 20/20 had a feature here in NZ about peoples obsession with antibacterial soap which contained certain chemicals usually used in preop srub formulas for hospitals, they were concerned re the bugs gaining resistance to them, poo poohed by the manufacturers of course!
These things will come back to haunt us just look at MSR superbugs in hospitals that just kill people and are so resistant to being killed, we are making or own next nemesis through believe in our "understanding" of nature and trust in scientists to come up with a "cure all"
I liken it to the first two world wars they started on horses and ended in tanks, barrage ballons to supersonic jets, well if we can do that in the space of a few years at the frontline what the heck are the bugs up to?
As you say not all bacteria is bad infact studies have shown that ther is more bacteria present after you wash than before as the all replicate to fill the void.
Also immune deficiency diseases, allergies, asthma etc etc are all on the increase partly due to peoples obssession with being clean and antibacterial sprays wipes tissues etc etc.
When I was a kid we rolled in and played in and ate dirt, spiders whatever, chewed grass stalks, without our parents worrying unduly, now its like every baby is the boy in the bubble!!
as you say bleach alcohol, iodine, aloe vera, plain ol' soapy water are all we need.
I myself am unable to take penicillin, or medication with sulphur base due to risk of anaphylatic shock, but you know it just means being careful and taking something else ONLY when absolutely essential, the drugs can kill me as much as save me.
I think the world needs to delve deeper into the sponges and plants that are providing cures we have yet to dream of but given the destruction of pristine ecosystems by thoughtless money hungry short sighted "developers" (a misnomer if there ever was one) and governments, one wonders what we have already lost.
These things will come back to haunt us just look at MSR superbugs in hospitals that just kill people and are so resistant to being killed, we are making or own next nemesis through believe in our "understanding" of nature and trust in scientists to come up with a "cure all"
I liken it to the first two world wars they started on horses and ended in tanks, barrage ballons to supersonic jets, well if we can do that in the space of a few years at the frontline what the heck are the bugs up to?
As you say not all bacteria is bad infact studies have shown that ther is more bacteria present after you wash than before as the all replicate to fill the void.
Also immune deficiency diseases, allergies, asthma etc etc are all on the increase partly due to peoples obssession with being clean and antibacterial sprays wipes tissues etc etc.
When I was a kid we rolled in and played in and ate dirt, spiders whatever, chewed grass stalks, without our parents worrying unduly, now its like every baby is the boy in the bubble!!
as you say bleach alcohol, iodine, aloe vera, plain ol' soapy water are all we need.
I myself am unable to take penicillin, or medication with sulphur base due to risk of anaphylatic shock, but you know it just means being careful and taking something else ONLY when absolutely essential, the drugs can kill me as much as save me.
I think the world needs to delve deeper into the sponges and plants that are providing cures we have yet to dream of but given the destruction of pristine ecosystems by thoughtless money hungry short sighted "developers" (a misnomer if there ever was one) and governments, one wonders what we have already lost.
Sean Cavanaugh [Visitor] writes:
Yep. There are so many natural remedies available, and many of them aren't just equal to, but actually surpass man-made drugs in terms of efficacy.
Example: I lived in Mexico and Central America for a year, and at some point when I was in Oaxaca (probably the coastal region around Puerto Angel) I picked up a nasty bug or parasite. I was fairly certain it wasn't a viral infection because I never experienced a high fever for any length of time, and I didn't think it was food poisoning because the symptoms persisted for so many days, at times improving only to worsen the next day. Something, perhaps a protozoan infection such as entamoeba histolytica or giardia lamblia, was causing dysentary-like symptoms, and after several days of it, and fearing the dehydration and steady weight loss, I decided it was time to visit a medico.
He prescribed grapefruit seed extract, 6 drops in a glass of water or juice, every three hours. I started feeling better the next day, and within a couple of days, I had regained my appetite and normal bowel function. Within two weeks, I put back all the weight I had lost.
I wish I had discovered it sooner. You can take it regularly as a prophylaxis, or use it therapeutically in the event of an active infection. It alkalizes the blood and other bodily fluids (I know it sounds rather counter-intuitive because citrus is so acidic, but apparently the manner in which we metabolize it creates the alkalizing effect), and most microorganisms can't survive an alkaline, oxygenated state, or at least can't flourish in it. And while that's a big part of its effect, apparently GSE contains a substance that disrupts a microorganism's cytoplasmic membranes a la antibiotics, but in a manner more like a cationic peptide where resistance is next to impossible.
It's not like doctors in Mexico don't have antibiotics at their disposal, but they're expensive, insurance is uncommon, and the pharmaceutical industry there hasn't gone out of its way to malign natural remedies, so they typically rely on them as their first course of action.
Our healthcare system could learn something from that approach. And quite possibly it is. My doctor recently prescribed a regimen of fish oil extract, garlic and soy protein to treat my high(ish) cholesterol. He said if I don't get to my goal numbers within six months, I may have to consider statins, but I was pleasantly surprised he didn't jump to that option right off the bat.
So... I'm rambling again. I'm going to do some web research on GSE's effect on viral infections. Hasta.
Example: I lived in Mexico and Central America for a year, and at some point when I was in Oaxaca (probably the coastal region around Puerto Angel) I picked up a nasty bug or parasite. I was fairly certain it wasn't a viral infection because I never experienced a high fever for any length of time, and I didn't think it was food poisoning because the symptoms persisted for so many days, at times improving only to worsen the next day. Something, perhaps a protozoan infection such as entamoeba histolytica or giardia lamblia, was causing dysentary-like symptoms, and after several days of it, and fearing the dehydration and steady weight loss, I decided it was time to visit a medico.
He prescribed grapefruit seed extract, 6 drops in a glass of water or juice, every three hours. I started feeling better the next day, and within a couple of days, I had regained my appetite and normal bowel function. Within two weeks, I put back all the weight I had lost.
I wish I had discovered it sooner. You can take it regularly as a prophylaxis, or use it therapeutically in the event of an active infection. It alkalizes the blood and other bodily fluids (I know it sounds rather counter-intuitive because citrus is so acidic, but apparently the manner in which we metabolize it creates the alkalizing effect), and most microorganisms can't survive an alkaline, oxygenated state, or at least can't flourish in it. And while that's a big part of its effect, apparently GSE contains a substance that disrupts a microorganism's cytoplasmic membranes a la antibiotics, but in a manner more like a cationic peptide where resistance is next to impossible.
It's not like doctors in Mexico don't have antibiotics at their disposal, but they're expensive, insurance is uncommon, and the pharmaceutical industry there hasn't gone out of its way to malign natural remedies, so they typically rely on them as their first course of action.
Our healthcare system could learn something from that approach. And quite possibly it is. My doctor recently prescribed a regimen of fish oil extract, garlic and soy protein to treat my high(ish) cholesterol. He said if I don't get to my goal numbers within six months, I may have to consider statins, but I was pleasantly surprised he didn't jump to that option right off the bat.
So... I'm rambling again. I'm going to do some web research on GSE's effect on viral infections. Hasta.
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
Kiwi:
You are so right about Americans expecting the Government to arrive ...like the Cavalry in old westerns.
I grew up in New York City, where it is still a way of life to think nothing can happen to you ...and if it does, it will be fixed by those in charge. And it usually was. When I was a kid anyway.
"Rural" folk (not suburban) have always had a better handle on real emergency situations. Unfortunately, those hearty rural folk didn't have the same proximity to good doctors, libraries and good paying jobs. A delicate balance. But that has certainly been improved by the internet.
The Boy Scout code makes total sense to me.
Just looking at the east coast of Florida shows that the advice of THREE days of food and water is less than adequate in these times.
A good deal of problems down there are from people who took NO advice (although the East coast of the state had no idea they would be hit so badly by Wilma...but could have considered it).
I do think, however, that it's time for the Government to re-access their usual advice ...and tell people to have supplies for 7-10 days.
As for shaking hands, I try to avoid it and keep little hand wipes at my place of business.
If somone sneezes at the supermarket I have been known to hold my breath and run.
People rebuilding in dangerous natural disaster zones, was the subject of a comedy routine Jackie Mason did (In his Broadway show).
He humorously asked why people kept rebuilding homes after tornadoes, if every year those houses got lifted up , torn apart and blown all over town ...again and again.
The answer he got was: "Because our roots are here." Haha!
I have previously spoken of rich developers who are currently still building homes on "pretty" beaches and wetlands.
Some, sadly, with what is called "interest only" loans, where they borow, build, then rent these homes, while paying ONLY interest on the loans. They make a lot of money doing this.
Very often, by the time a storm wipes out the house, they have already made the price of the home over five times!
What do they care about the environment or Cape Cod?
And WE end up paying for the cleanups. Even for the rich.
And we also lose more and more wetlands and coastlines from erosion.
I completely agree local and state governments needs stronger restrictions in precarious wetland areas.
But, as long as local government is as susceptible to corruption as is Washington ...it is still a long road upward.
Get out and "VOTE" has been my clarion call.
You are indeed an idealist. But that's OK. We have pessimists galore.
Don't change. We need more people who can, "see" the good place if we are ever to get there.
You are so right about Americans expecting the Government to arrive ...like the Cavalry in old westerns.
I grew up in New York City, where it is still a way of life to think nothing can happen to you ...and if it does, it will be fixed by those in charge. And it usually was. When I was a kid anyway.
"Rural" folk (not suburban) have always had a better handle on real emergency situations. Unfortunately, those hearty rural folk didn't have the same proximity to good doctors, libraries and good paying jobs. A delicate balance. But that has certainly been improved by the internet.
The Boy Scout code makes total sense to me.
Just looking at the east coast of Florida shows that the advice of THREE days of food and water is less than adequate in these times.
A good deal of problems down there are from people who took NO advice (although the East coast of the state had no idea they would be hit so badly by Wilma...but could have considered it).
I do think, however, that it's time for the Government to re-access their usual advice ...and tell people to have supplies for 7-10 days.
As for shaking hands, I try to avoid it and keep little hand wipes at my place of business.
If somone sneezes at the supermarket I have been known to hold my breath and run.
People rebuilding in dangerous natural disaster zones, was the subject of a comedy routine Jackie Mason did (In his Broadway show).
He humorously asked why people kept rebuilding homes after tornadoes, if every year those houses got lifted up , torn apart and blown all over town ...again and again.
The answer he got was: "Because our roots are here." Haha!
I have previously spoken of rich developers who are currently still building homes on "pretty" beaches and wetlands.
Some, sadly, with what is called "interest only" loans, where they borow, build, then rent these homes, while paying ONLY interest on the loans. They make a lot of money doing this.
Very often, by the time a storm wipes out the house, they have already made the price of the home over five times!
What do they care about the environment or Cape Cod?
And WE end up paying for the cleanups. Even for the rich.
And we also lose more and more wetlands and coastlines from erosion.
I completely agree local and state governments needs stronger restrictions in precarious wetland areas.
But, as long as local government is as susceptible to corruption as is Washington ...it is still a long road upward.
Get out and "VOTE" has been my clarion call.
You are indeed an idealist. But that's OK. We have pessimists galore.
Don't change. We need more people who can, "see" the good place if we are ever to get there.
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
Sean:
TAMIFLU was the first drug I mentioned in my above blog. And how it is no longer working due to overuse in Asia. I also wrote that China has about the highest rate of resistance to ALL antivirals due to overuse (70% resistance to TAMIFLU).
I also spoke a bit about the new forms (inhalants and injections after exposure) they are working for on Relenza, as well as the overwhelming odds of human to human infection happening in the near future, and it taking at least 6 months from that time on to make any successful vaccine since we need to see the final mutated form.
As for eggs not being of much value in the near future, I also mentioned that scientists are currently working on in vitro products to culture the virus for vaccine.
I very much appreciate your compliments about my blog humor, but am now wondering if you read my entire blog or just "perused" it, since I have covered many of the things you mention in this particular comment.
But, Sean, you ARE very in touch with what is happening (your last comment on natural remedies is very interesting) which leads me to say this:
I will soon move on to OTHER subjects after this blog, but I think CapeCodToday would be well served by YOU contacting our editor in chief, and doing a Blog yourself.
You write well, know much and the blog public could use updates on bird flu, as well as many other diseases and subjects in science that you are knowledgeable in).
It would be very valuable thing to check in on your blog and get some interesting scientific facts about a lot of things.
Your intellect and education are not only important assets, but enjoyable as well.
Think about it.
*It's too bad I can't use any grapefruit products (due to interaction with a drug I am taking), but, yes, there ARE so many other natural remedies to many of life's ills.
TAMIFLU was the first drug I mentioned in my above blog. And how it is no longer working due to overuse in Asia. I also wrote that China has about the highest rate of resistance to ALL antivirals due to overuse (70% resistance to TAMIFLU).
I also spoke a bit about the new forms (inhalants and injections after exposure) they are working for on Relenza, as well as the overwhelming odds of human to human infection happening in the near future, and it taking at least 6 months from that time on to make any successful vaccine since we need to see the final mutated form.
As for eggs not being of much value in the near future, I also mentioned that scientists are currently working on in vitro products to culture the virus for vaccine.
I very much appreciate your compliments about my blog humor, but am now wondering if you read my entire blog or just "perused" it, since I have covered many of the things you mention in this particular comment.
But, Sean, you ARE very in touch with what is happening (your last comment on natural remedies is very interesting) which leads me to say this:
I will soon move on to OTHER subjects after this blog, but I think CapeCodToday would be well served by YOU contacting our editor in chief, and doing a Blog yourself.
You write well, know much and the blog public could use updates on bird flu, as well as many other diseases and subjects in science that you are knowledgeable in).
It would be very valuable thing to check in on your blog and get some interesting scientific facts about a lot of things.
Your intellect and education are not only important assets, but enjoyable as well.
Think about it.
*It's too bad I can't use any grapefruit products (due to interaction with a drug I am taking), but, yes, there ARE so many other natural remedies to many of life's ills.
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
Hog Wild:
I am very happy you made it through such a bad experience with the flu. It sounds like Boston had a bad, bad, bug that year.
But you do make a good point, in that we did not pop pills like candy for everything back then. It very well could be the reason you lived. Love, care and as you say, a little "blessing" never hurts either.
You bet we need to stay on our "elected" (meaning they work for us) officials to stay on target with this important issue.
Thanks for the comments and stay well.
Doc:
Hmmm, I wonder if "Monkey Syndrome" has something to do with us descending from them. Hmmm...
Dubya is STILL not "convinced" about Global Warming. He, and a group of scientists (Probably "Intelligent Design" Scientists) are still "studying it ...which actually sounds even scarier than Global Warming to me.
But Bush IS sure Harriet Miers was the perfect choice for the Supreme Court.
And I bet he still thinks so, even though everyone but his mother (and maybe her too) pushed him to let her "resign," which she FINALLY did today! Yee-Ha!
Sean:
Vonnegut was being facetious ...albeit, as always, with a grain of philosophical wimsy and truth. BUT, he has amused me for decades with his wonderful musings on the absurdities and oddities of life, people, the earth, other planets and the whole universe.
The HOT ZONE idea of "amplification" of the human form, and how it might be starting to "wear" on the nerves of good old Mother Nature is interesting, but I tend to view things more like you do.
I have believed for years that the living earth, and all it sprouts (including us) are part of one living organism.
Where most people believe we are ON the earth, I have always seen us as OF the earth (Not a popular view in many circles..LOL).
I agree that the mutation of viruses is a good example of evolution.
We can see it now, whereas first peas and then the fruit fly were about as deep as we could go just a few decades ago (both with quick life cycles...or generations).
We used the peas to show genetics and how it could be manipulated, and the flies to see how evolution creates or changes genetics to test pesticides and medicines.
The debates over higher animal lab testing is a big one however.
And I wish more people would at least START understanding that the more forests and jungles in the tropics (from the Amazon to the African Equatorial areas), we cut down, the more viruses we are going to see. We are invading their sacred lands, and they have no choice but to declare war on us.
We are opening a Pandora's Box of viruses that would have been very happy to be left alone (now I am being facetious).
Atually, a new report, out this week, claims that with even a little SLIGHT heating from Global warming , we can expect to see some invasions , of not just more viruses, but more and more insects (mosquitos anyone) and bugs all over our now comfortable human habitats.
But, back to us.
I sometimes think we people probably ARE a virus ...The Human Virus...in the basic sense of what a virus really is. We just got big.
I even think our fears about other people (racism, ethnic differences and religion...as well as fear of Martians et al) come from instincive worrying that someone or something plans to find an antibiotic or antiviral for all of us.
Sometimes I also think we are just prgrammed to do it to ourselves. Perhaps it is ingrained in our DNA.
Some radical scientific theories (yes radical scientists as well as radical religionists) have shown "hints" (not results) that civilizations ...and even some species ...can grow only so much before caving back in on themselves...much like Supernova's.
As I said, radical, but nonetheless interesting.
And that is not a far a stretch from those who believe that the Big Bang itself (and we are microcosms of it) may one day stop expanding, and head backwards towards a new nucleus.
I was awed, back in my twenties, after reading books by the great Jesuit Priest and Scientist, Pierre Teilhard (who held about 8 Phd's). He died way back in1953, but not before always getting into trouble with the Church in Rome for his scientific views.
He saw ALL matter in either a "Life" or "Pre-life "state (He was a "little" ahead of his time).
Even a rock, was alive to him...just not yet in a living state.
He made me look at things differently (especially rocks).
He showed me the "Within" (now called the quantum world..but only atomic in his day) and the "Without" ...the planets and stars and other matter of the universe ... all matter and made of the same basic elements as us.
Ironically, he saw all of his science as a way the human race was coming together into a form that would be unified in Christ.
One of the reasons the Pope sent him to NYC (getting him out of his homeland in France) instead of Excommunicating him. :)
Yup, those flying dinosaurs sure are pretty.
Get yourself a Blog you interesting man. I will visit often.
I am very happy you made it through such a bad experience with the flu. It sounds like Boston had a bad, bad, bug that year.
But you do make a good point, in that we did not pop pills like candy for everything back then. It very well could be the reason you lived. Love, care and as you say, a little "blessing" never hurts either.
You bet we need to stay on our "elected" (meaning they work for us) officials to stay on target with this important issue.
Thanks for the comments and stay well.
Doc:
Hmmm, I wonder if "Monkey Syndrome" has something to do with us descending from them. Hmmm...
Dubya is STILL not "convinced" about Global Warming. He, and a group of scientists (Probably "Intelligent Design" Scientists) are still "studying it ...which actually sounds even scarier than Global Warming to me.
But Bush IS sure Harriet Miers was the perfect choice for the Supreme Court.
And I bet he still thinks so, even though everyone but his mother (and maybe her too) pushed him to let her "resign," which she FINALLY did today! Yee-Ha!
Sean:
Vonnegut was being facetious ...albeit, as always, with a grain of philosophical wimsy and truth. BUT, he has amused me for decades with his wonderful musings on the absurdities and oddities of life, people, the earth, other planets and the whole universe.
The HOT ZONE idea of "amplification" of the human form, and how it might be starting to "wear" on the nerves of good old Mother Nature is interesting, but I tend to view things more like you do.
I have believed for years that the living earth, and all it sprouts (including us) are part of one living organism.
Where most people believe we are ON the earth, I have always seen us as OF the earth (Not a popular view in many circles..LOL).
I agree that the mutation of viruses is a good example of evolution.
We can see it now, whereas first peas and then the fruit fly were about as deep as we could go just a few decades ago (both with quick life cycles...or generations).
We used the peas to show genetics and how it could be manipulated, and the flies to see how evolution creates or changes genetics to test pesticides and medicines.
The debates over higher animal lab testing is a big one however.
And I wish more people would at least START understanding that the more forests and jungles in the tropics (from the Amazon to the African Equatorial areas), we cut down, the more viruses we are going to see. We are invading their sacred lands, and they have no choice but to declare war on us.
We are opening a Pandora's Box of viruses that would have been very happy to be left alone (now I am being facetious).
Atually, a new report, out this week, claims that with even a little SLIGHT heating from Global warming , we can expect to see some invasions , of not just more viruses, but more and more insects (mosquitos anyone) and bugs all over our now comfortable human habitats.
But, back to us.
I sometimes think we people probably ARE a virus ...The Human Virus...in the basic sense of what a virus really is. We just got big.
I even think our fears about other people (racism, ethnic differences and religion...as well as fear of Martians et al) come from instincive worrying that someone or something plans to find an antibiotic or antiviral for all of us.
Sometimes I also think we are just prgrammed to do it to ourselves. Perhaps it is ingrained in our DNA.
Some radical scientific theories (yes radical scientists as well as radical religionists) have shown "hints" (not results) that civilizations ...and even some species ...can grow only so much before caving back in on themselves...much like Supernova's.
As I said, radical, but nonetheless interesting.
And that is not a far a stretch from those who believe that the Big Bang itself (and we are microcosms of it) may one day stop expanding, and head backwards towards a new nucleus.
I was awed, back in my twenties, after reading books by the great Jesuit Priest and Scientist, Pierre Teilhard (who held about 8 Phd's). He died way back in1953, but not before always getting into trouble with the Church in Rome for his scientific views.
He saw ALL matter in either a "Life" or "Pre-life "state (He was a "little" ahead of his time).
Even a rock, was alive to him...just not yet in a living state.
He made me look at things differently (especially rocks).
He showed me the "Within" (now called the quantum world..but only atomic in his day) and the "Without" ...the planets and stars and other matter of the universe ... all matter and made of the same basic elements as us.
Ironically, he saw all of his science as a way the human race was coming together into a form that would be unified in Christ.
One of the reasons the Pope sent him to NYC (getting him out of his homeland in France) instead of Excommunicating him. :)
Yup, those flying dinosaurs sure are pretty.
Get yourself a Blog you interesting man. I will visit often.
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
Kiwi:
You bet the antibiotics in feed are killing us (long range).
I, myself now buy natural beef (sans hormones and anibiotics), but as I said in my blog, free-range chicken eaters may be in for a "dry" period.
Yup, those farm raised salmon will do us in as well now...sadly for me ...who LOVES Salmon, but can't afford Alaskan as often as I would like. But I would not touch the stuff now.
....It figures they tell us salmon is the healthiest fish we can eat....and then they poison it!
Grrrrrrr.....
You said, (about Viacam nasal spray to ward off colds):
>>> "Well come on man whats wrong with eucalyptis oil in a bowl of hot water, or some honey or propalis or vicks cough lollies or good old chicken soup!"
You bet the antibiotics in feed are killing us (long range).
I, myself now buy natural beef (sans hormones and anibiotics), but as I said in my blog, free-range chicken eaters may be in for a "dry" period.
Yup, those farm raised salmon will do us in as well now...sadly for me ...who LOVES Salmon, but can't afford Alaskan as often as I would like. But I would not touch the stuff now.
....It figures they tell us salmon is the healthiest fish we can eat....and then they poison it!
Grrrrrrr.....
You said, (about Viacam nasal spray to ward off colds):
>>> "Well come on man whats wrong with eucalyptis oil in a bowl of hot water, or some honey or propalis or vicks cough lollies or good old chicken soup!"
Sean Cavanaugh [Visitor] writes:
JC, thanks for the kind words. And yes, I did read your entire entry intently (although it's possible I missed a few of the follow-up comments). Anyway, I replied the way I did regarding Tamiflu because I'm not sure resistance to it is as widespread as you implied. The evidence doesn't support it (despite some press reports, some of which have been retracted or otherwise re-considered). There has only been one case of Tamiflu-resistance, and the resistance was only partial. In the original blog entry, you were talking about Tamiflu resistance specifically, then antivirals in general, and it sounded to me like you were equating the worrisome stats of the latter to the former. For certain antiviral drugs such as Amantadine, resistance is near universal, and even if more cases of Tamiflu resistance are pending, it's nowhere the level of amantadine-resistance. I didn't want to call out attention to what I considered an inconsistency on your part (I'm new here... I don't want to alienate the author!), so I simply asserted what I understand to be the case as matter-of-factly as I could. I apologize for not addressing your comment more directly.
I really do think Tamiflu is our best bet, however (unless further cases indicate the resistance is widespread). That's not to say it's a better drug than Relenza -- there are biological reasons to believe both drugs would not exhibit the kind of resistance that amantadine does, and further, the H5N1 isolate that did exhibit partial Tamiflu-resistance was in fact sensitive to Relenza (good news) -- but in terms of production, Relenza has been made in very limited quantities, and it's unclear how quickly GlaxoSmithKline could, or would be willing to, change that.
Regarding vaccine production, I am aware that new techniques and methods are being explored, but I'm still not convinced how much use they'll be in the near term, if it turns out we require a solution by then. Do we have a couple of years? Maybe. But if a pandemic strain were to emerge during or shortly after this year's seasonal flu epidemic, we're SOL. Sure, we'll be able to produce a vaccine for it using current (chicken embryo) methods, but it will take up to six months, and by that time, much if not most of the human carnage will have already occurred.
Re: starting my own blog here, I'm flattered by the suggestion, but I'm not sure I'm qualified (assuming we're talking about an influenza-specific blog). I had stated previously that I'm a former plant pathologist, but now I feel I need to clarify that a bit. I was a graduate research assistant in plant pathology and electron microscopy. I researched cereal viruses such as Barley Stripe Mosaic Virus, and while my name appears on a few papers, I never directed any research on my own, nor do I hold an advanced degree in plant pathology (which the term "pathologist" sort of implies). I'm also not a healthcare professional. I just happen to remain very interested in virology, and my background, modest though it is, affords me the opportunity to read and digest some of the technical literature on a level that many people probably can't. That's the long way of saying I have no expertise in the field of human virology or epidemiology, and if anyone were to rely on my input as authoritative, I don't think I could live handle the responsibility.
I really do think Tamiflu is our best bet, however (unless further cases indicate the resistance is widespread). That's not to say it's a better drug than Relenza -- there are biological reasons to believe both drugs would not exhibit the kind of resistance that amantadine does, and further, the H5N1 isolate that did exhibit partial Tamiflu-resistance was in fact sensitive to Relenza (good news) -- but in terms of production, Relenza has been made in very limited quantities, and it's unclear how quickly GlaxoSmithKline could, or would be willing to, change that.
Regarding vaccine production, I am aware that new techniques and methods are being explored, but I'm still not convinced how much use they'll be in the near term, if it turns out we require a solution by then. Do we have a couple of years? Maybe. But if a pandemic strain were to emerge during or shortly after this year's seasonal flu epidemic, we're SOL. Sure, we'll be able to produce a vaccine for it using current (chicken embryo) methods, but it will take up to six months, and by that time, much if not most of the human carnage will have already occurred.
Re: starting my own blog here, I'm flattered by the suggestion, but I'm not sure I'm qualified (assuming we're talking about an influenza-specific blog). I had stated previously that I'm a former plant pathologist, but now I feel I need to clarify that a bit. I was a graduate research assistant in plant pathology and electron microscopy. I researched cereal viruses such as Barley Stripe Mosaic Virus, and while my name appears on a few papers, I never directed any research on my own, nor do I hold an advanced degree in plant pathology (which the term "pathologist" sort of implies). I'm also not a healthcare professional. I just happen to remain very interested in virology, and my background, modest though it is, affords me the opportunity to read and digest some of the technical literature on a level that many people probably can't. That's the long way of saying I have no expertise in the field of human virology or epidemiology, and if anyone were to rely on my input as authoritative, I don't think I could live handle the responsibility.
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
Sean:
Thanks for your good manners as well as your keen mind.
If your facts are newer or more specific than mine, I am always open to hearing it.
Antivirals, amantadine etc., have been overused for sure, and resistance is certainly high, but I hope some use may still be found for them.
The 70% resistance rate to Tamiflu that I mentioned, just concerned the Chinese, and some close neighbors.
As you said, TAMIFLU may not be as resisant in people who never used it, although, the viruses travel further than we do.
We can at least hope it works on those of us who never touched the stuff.
Hey, I'm getting MY stockpile of Tamiflu if I can.
I'm willing to gamble it "might" work, despite any controversy. :)
Relenza might end up a good back-up, and sounds like it may have some promise (as an inhalant or in an intravenous way), but, as you also say, it could be hard to produce in large quantity.
However, some good news I heard this week was that some smaller companies are being
sub-contracted by the Big Boys to help out..and share the production. Let's hope it's true.
That six to twelve month vaccine problem still exists, but, like you, I think our first line of defense has to be a drug to lessen the severity of the actual virus as it attacks.
As for you having a blog?
I just think you have some interesting things to say, and you say them well. I am sure many would like to hear you "chatting" on a variety of subjects on these pages. Not just about the flu.
Hey, I would be interested in local plant pathologies, biology and related subjects here on Cape Cod (and other places).
At any rate, please visit again. You are always welcome.
To ALL THOSE who said I should not "politicize" the Avian Flu:
The U.S. Senate approved an EIGHT BILLION dollar appropration this week to start the fight against Bird Flu.
Senators Tom Harkin from Iowa and Barack Obama from IL, were just a few of the Senators that warned this pandemic could be worse than terrorism and just as devastating to our economy as well our people backed it. Doing nothing is no longer an option.
Now, all we have to do is see if the House of Reps. backs the bill too.
The breakdown of the money is this: $3.3 billion for approximately 120 million doses of vaccine (as it is "Hopefully" created), and another $3 billion for Anti Viral drugs ...to be given as people got sick. The money would cover for about 1/2 the does for the American population.
The rest would be spent to help hospitals deal with the rush, and to track human outbreaks.
This is a good start. But we are no doubt going to need much more than $8 billion before this is through.
Let's hope the House or Reps. finds agreeing with the Senate just a Bipartisan smart move.
Thanks for your good manners as well as your keen mind.
If your facts are newer or more specific than mine, I am always open to hearing it.
Antivirals, amantadine etc., have been overused for sure, and resistance is certainly high, but I hope some use may still be found for them.
The 70% resistance rate to Tamiflu that I mentioned, just concerned the Chinese, and some close neighbors.
As you said, TAMIFLU may not be as resisant in people who never used it, although, the viruses travel further than we do.
We can at least hope it works on those of us who never touched the stuff.
Hey, I'm getting MY stockpile of Tamiflu if I can.
I'm willing to gamble it "might" work, despite any controversy. :)
Relenza might end up a good back-up, and sounds like it may have some promise (as an inhalant or in an intravenous way), but, as you also say, it could be hard to produce in large quantity.
However, some good news I heard this week was that some smaller companies are being
sub-contracted by the Big Boys to help out..and share the production. Let's hope it's true.
That six to twelve month vaccine problem still exists, but, like you, I think our first line of defense has to be a drug to lessen the severity of the actual virus as it attacks.
As for you having a blog?
I just think you have some interesting things to say, and you say them well. I am sure many would like to hear you "chatting" on a variety of subjects on these pages. Not just about the flu.
Hey, I would be interested in local plant pathologies, biology and related subjects here on Cape Cod (and other places).
At any rate, please visit again. You are always welcome.
To ALL THOSE who said I should not "politicize" the Avian Flu:
The U.S. Senate approved an EIGHT BILLION dollar appropration this week to start the fight against Bird Flu.
Senators Tom Harkin from Iowa and Barack Obama from IL, were just a few of the Senators that warned this pandemic could be worse than terrorism and just as devastating to our economy as well our people backed it. Doing nothing is no longer an option.
Now, all we have to do is see if the House of Reps. backs the bill too.
The breakdown of the money is this: $3.3 billion for approximately 120 million doses of vaccine (as it is "Hopefully" created), and another $3 billion for Anti Viral drugs ...to be given as people got sick. The money would cover for about 1/2 the does for the American population.
The rest would be spent to help hospitals deal with the rush, and to track human outbreaks.
This is a good start. But we are no doubt going to need much more than $8 billion before this is through.
Let's hope the House or Reps. finds agreeing with the Senate just a Bipartisan smart move.
Sean Cavanaugh [Visitor] writes:
"The 70% resistance rate to Tamiflu that I mentioned, just concerned the Chinese, and some close neighbors."
JC, that's the number for which I can't find any supporting information. For current H5N1 isolates, the highest Tamiflu-resistance figures and estimates are in the neighborhood of 1%, with the caveat that this is expected to rise steadily after a pandemic strain emerges, but even that might not be such bad news.
Let me explain that last part....
I've found many studies concerning Tamiflu resistance in other influenza strains (H1N1 and H3N2), but the highest resistance rates were in the range of 16-18% among select Japanese children. And in these studies, the resistance developed *after* treatment with Tamiflu, i.e., the children were not infected with Tamiflu-resistant strains, but rather the Tamiflu-resistant strains developed within the individual child. This is good news. Because Tamiflu (and Relenza for that matter) is a neuraminidase inhibitor, mutations that lead to resistance also tend to diminish the virus's transmissibility and virulence due to the fact that the genetic sequence for neuraminidase is highly conserved across influenza strains. This is no guarantee that a robust, transmissible, Tamiflu-resistant strain won't emerge, but the likelihood is considerably less than for other anti-viral agents.
Also -- and I apologize in advance if I misread what you wrote -- but whether a person has used Tamiflu or Relenza in the past does not necessarily lessen the drug's efficacy for that person should he become infected with another flu strain, either pandemic or seasonal. "Resistance" (or its opposite, "sensitivity") is a property of the virus, not the individual host. Obviously, Tamiflu-resistant strains can only develop in hosts being treated with Tamiflu, but it is believed that such resistant strains will be less severe, perhaps even crippled. I really hope that's the case.
JC, that's the number for which I can't find any supporting information. For current H5N1 isolates, the highest Tamiflu-resistance figures and estimates are in the neighborhood of 1%, with the caveat that this is expected to rise steadily after a pandemic strain emerges, but even that might not be such bad news.
Let me explain that last part....
I've found many studies concerning Tamiflu resistance in other influenza strains (H1N1 and H3N2), but the highest resistance rates were in the range of 16-18% among select Japanese children. And in these studies, the resistance developed *after* treatment with Tamiflu, i.e., the children were not infected with Tamiflu-resistant strains, but rather the Tamiflu-resistant strains developed within the individual child. This is good news. Because Tamiflu (and Relenza for that matter) is a neuraminidase inhibitor, mutations that lead to resistance also tend to diminish the virus's transmissibility and virulence due to the fact that the genetic sequence for neuraminidase is highly conserved across influenza strains. This is no guarantee that a robust, transmissible, Tamiflu-resistant strain won't emerge, but the likelihood is considerably less than for other anti-viral agents.
Also -- and I apologize in advance if I misread what you wrote -- but whether a person has used Tamiflu or Relenza in the past does not necessarily lessen the drug's efficacy for that person should he become infected with another flu strain, either pandemic or seasonal. "Resistance" (or its opposite, "sensitivity") is a property of the virus, not the individual host. Obviously, Tamiflu-resistant strains can only develop in hosts being treated with Tamiflu, but it is believed that such resistant strains will be less severe, perhaps even crippled. I really hope that's the case.
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
Sean:
From what I get from how you explain the "resistance" factor to TAMIFLU, the Japanese children developed resistance AFTER being treated with it.
That fits with what I was saying. No problems there.
But, it still does not assure, as you mention, that a resistant strain won't evolve and get around. Sadly...
I wonder, if the children who developed the TAMIFLU resistant strains of the "bug" after having the flu...and being cured.....could be infected again as the H5N1 mutates? Hmm....
As for your odds of a TAMIFLU resistant strain less likely to emerge due to less tranmissibilty because of the neuramaninidase conservation, let's hope you are right.
As I mentioned in my last comment, the Senate approved a new Bill to fight the "possible" pandemic.....and I guess the House approved it ....as President Bush announced his plans to spend the 8 Billion on it yesterday (Thank goodness a start at least).
In his speech, however, he mentioned 1 Billion for stockpiling, whereas my Senate Bill mentioned more...BUT...I guess that's Politics. Compromise, compromise.
The 70 per cent rate of RESISTANCE to TAMIFLU that I mentioned, was noted in the LANCET medical journal.
I recieve a newsletter from a major American university that picked up the story quoting two reports in "The Lancet" medical journal this month saying that resistance to anti-influenza drugs was growing worldwide.
"In places such as China, drug resistance exceeded 70 percent, suggesting that drugs like amantadine and rimantadine will probably no longer be effective for treatment or as a preventive in a pandemic outbreak of flu," the report said.
The story also quotes "William Chui, honorary associate professor with the Department of Pharmacology at the Queen Mary Hospital in Hong Kong, telling Reuters News Agency:
"There are now resistant H5N1 strains [isolates] appearing, and we can't totally rely on one drug (Tamiflu)."
According to the rest of the story, Chui was referring to the Tamiflu-resistant strain of H5N1 [avian influenza] in Viet Nam. He also said general viral resistance to Tamiflu was growing in Japan, where doctors habitually prescribe the drug to fight common influenza.
The Reuters story, dated Sept. 30th, had a Byline: Tan Ee Lyn.
Hope that helps clarify. Scary as it is.
From what I get from how you explain the "resistance" factor to TAMIFLU, the Japanese children developed resistance AFTER being treated with it.
That fits with what I was saying. No problems there.
But, it still does not assure, as you mention, that a resistant strain won't evolve and get around. Sadly...
I wonder, if the children who developed the TAMIFLU resistant strains of the "bug" after having the flu...and being cured.....could be infected again as the H5N1 mutates? Hmm....
As for your odds of a TAMIFLU resistant strain less likely to emerge due to less tranmissibilty because of the neuramaninidase conservation, let's hope you are right.
As I mentioned in my last comment, the Senate approved a new Bill to fight the "possible" pandemic.....and I guess the House approved it ....as President Bush announced his plans to spend the 8 Billion on it yesterday (Thank goodness a start at least).
In his speech, however, he mentioned 1 Billion for stockpiling, whereas my Senate Bill mentioned more...BUT...I guess that's Politics. Compromise, compromise.
The 70 per cent rate of RESISTANCE to TAMIFLU that I mentioned, was noted in the LANCET medical journal.
I recieve a newsletter from a major American university that picked up the story quoting two reports in "The Lancet" medical journal this month saying that resistance to anti-influenza drugs was growing worldwide.
"In places such as China, drug resistance exceeded 70 percent, suggesting that drugs like amantadine and rimantadine will probably no longer be effective for treatment or as a preventive in a pandemic outbreak of flu," the report said.
The story also quotes "William Chui, honorary associate professor with the Department of Pharmacology at the Queen Mary Hospital in Hong Kong, telling Reuters News Agency:
"There are now resistant H5N1 strains [isolates] appearing, and we can't totally rely on one drug (Tamiflu)."
According to the rest of the story, Chui was referring to the Tamiflu-resistant strain of H5N1 [avian influenza] in Viet Nam. He also said general viral resistance to Tamiflu was growing in Japan, where doctors habitually prescribe the drug to fight common influenza.
The Reuters story, dated Sept. 30th, had a Byline: Tan Ee Lyn.
Hope that helps clarify. Scary as it is.
Sean Cavanaugh [Visitor] writes:
JC,
The Japanese children, per se, didn't develop resistance -- the *virus* developed resistance after the children were treated with Tamiflu. In other words, the virus isolates obtained from these children were different than the virus they were initially infected with; the virus had mutated within them, acquiring Tamiflu resistance. The good news in these cases was that the mutated viruses were no longer transmissable. It appears that the mutation that gave the virus resistance also crippled it.
> The 70 per cent rate of RESISTANCE
> to TAMIFLU that I mentioned, was noted
> in the LANCET medical journal.
As I mentioned previously, this was the number that was really scaring me. I could find no supporting information, but I didn't want to dismiss it, so I followed up by locating the Lancet study. The 70% resistance figure is in fact in reference to a class of anti-viral drugs known as "amantadanes" (Amantadine, Rimantadine), NOT (repeat, not) oseltamivir (Tamiflu) or zanamivir (Relenza). This article is from the Sept. 2005 issue of The Lancet (366:1175-1181). Here is a link to the abstract:
http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140673605673382/abstract
You will need to create an account to read it.
> two reports in "The Lancet" medical
> journal this month saying that
> resistance to anti-influenza
> drugs was growing worldwide
This is true. But it's important to DIFFERENTIATE the actual drugs for which viral strains have developed resistance. There has only been one case of Tamiflu resistance isolated from H5N1. Unfortunately, I don't know if that strain was crippled as were the human influenza strains isolated from the Japanese children. For all practical purposes, we can assume that virtually any/all emerging influenza strains (including H5N1) will be resistant to amantadanes. The 70% figure is probably somewhat low by now for this class of anti-viral drugs. But again, this is NOT the case with Tamiflu and Relenza. Nothing close to 70% resistance has developed. In fact, the figure is not even 1% of known H5N1 isolates, and even in the one known case, the resistance was merely partial.
Sorry if I appear to be harping on this point, but I think it's really important not to spread potentially misleading information. If you (or anyone reading your fine blog) has the opportunity to stockpile Tamiflu in their households, I HIGHLY recommend doing so. You can store it in your freezer and it will remain useable for several years. If you wait until a pandemic strain emerges, it will be next to impossible to obtain. I've found a couple of good sources in Canada, and will be contacting some sources in Mexico shortly.
So when's your next blog entry, JC? It's taken me awhile to build up my list of blogs to follow, and now that you're on it, I expect frequent updates. So get crackin'! ;-)
The Japanese children, per se, didn't develop resistance -- the *virus* developed resistance after the children were treated with Tamiflu. In other words, the virus isolates obtained from these children were different than the virus they were initially infected with; the virus had mutated within them, acquiring Tamiflu resistance. The good news in these cases was that the mutated viruses were no longer transmissable. It appears that the mutation that gave the virus resistance also crippled it.
> The 70 per cent rate of RESISTANCE
> to TAMIFLU that I mentioned, was noted
> in the LANCET medical journal.
As I mentioned previously, this was the number that was really scaring me. I could find no supporting information, but I didn't want to dismiss it, so I followed up by locating the Lancet study. The 70% resistance figure is in fact in reference to a class of anti-viral drugs known as "amantadanes" (Amantadine, Rimantadine), NOT (repeat, not) oseltamivir (Tamiflu) or zanamivir (Relenza). This article is from the Sept. 2005 issue of The Lancet (366:1175-1181). Here is a link to the abstract:
http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140673605673382/abstract
You will need to create an account to read it.
> two reports in "The Lancet" medical
> journal this month saying that
> resistance to anti-influenza
> drugs was growing worldwide
This is true. But it's important to DIFFERENTIATE the actual drugs for which viral strains have developed resistance. There has only been one case of Tamiflu resistance isolated from H5N1. Unfortunately, I don't know if that strain was crippled as were the human influenza strains isolated from the Japanese children. For all practical purposes, we can assume that virtually any/all emerging influenza strains (including H5N1) will be resistant to amantadanes. The 70% figure is probably somewhat low by now for this class of anti-viral drugs. But again, this is NOT the case with Tamiflu and Relenza. Nothing close to 70% resistance has developed. In fact, the figure is not even 1% of known H5N1 isolates, and even in the one known case, the resistance was merely partial.
Sorry if I appear to be harping on this point, but I think it's really important not to spread potentially misleading information. If you (or anyone reading your fine blog) has the opportunity to stockpile Tamiflu in their households, I HIGHLY recommend doing so. You can store it in your freezer and it will remain useable for several years. If you wait until a pandemic strain emerges, it will be next to impossible to obtain. I've found a couple of good sources in Canada, and will be contacting some sources in Mexico shortly.
So when's your next blog entry, JC? It's taken me awhile to build up my list of blogs to follow, and now that you're on it, I expect frequent updates. So get crackin'! ;-)
JC RappCity [Member] writes:
Sean:
I understand what you are saying, "The Japanese children, per se, didn't develop resistance -- the *virus* developed resistance after the children were treated with Tamiflu."
Of course it is the virus. I suppose I did not say it well.
Thank goodness it became non transmissable.
But, who knows how it may mutate somewhere else. Maybe this was an isolated mutation. It could mutate into a more agressively contagious flu as well I suppose.
I do want to say I appreciate your clarifying the 70% rate was for the "amantadanes" and not Tamiflu.
I did, however, mention the resistance to the "amantadanes", and how Relenza was a good viable drug ...(coming out in nsal spray and intravenous forms soon).
I think the "mixup"with my mentioning Tamiflu along with the "amantadanes" seems to be in the report I got.
The newsletter hazily inferred that Tamiflu was also involved.
Between the writing and translations in this newsletter(they report from around the world..sometimes English not being a first language), either I must have slightly misread that line ... or they mumbled in that area.
So thanks for the clarification.
However, in any case, it is the whole idea of the resistance factor that is my main point here.
I, in no way am expert enough to differentiate classes of drugs, only able to pass on what seems to be important information.
BUT, If my blog had the effect of you stopping by and furthering the knowledge about useable and non useable drugs for this flu, then it did its job and that is, as Martha says,"A good thing."
As for you "harping," No problem. It is good you are "exacting."
Your "homework" on this subject , only convinces me further that you would be such an asset to the readers of these pages in keeping us updated on correct facts ...medical items and terms being so complicated and all with your own blog. :)
Although the list of useless drugs to fight this virus will keep growing, there is not much we ordinary folk can do...
The doctors and scientists will hopefully be better able to keep accounts of which, individual drugs are good and bad for this horrid bug.
And hopefully will have enough MONEY with which to do it.
As for Tamiflu. You bet I have some!
Got it last week, and suggest others follow suit too.
Even if this "pandemic" never arrives, better, "safe than sorry."
I cannot imagine wanting to go out (or being allowed out in Quarantine situations) so we may be on our own if this thing breaks open.
Working hard before winter sets in...so much to do...but hope to post new blog this week.
Stick around Sean...
I understand what you are saying, "The Japanese children, per se, didn't develop resistance -- the *virus* developed resistance after the children were treated with Tamiflu."
Of course it is the virus. I suppose I did not say it well.
Thank goodness it became non transmissable.
But, who knows how it may mutate somewhere else. Maybe this was an isolated mutation. It could mutate into a more agressively contagious flu as well I suppose.
I do want to say I appreciate your clarifying the 70% rate was for the "amantadanes" and not Tamiflu.
I did, however, mention the resistance to the "amantadanes", and how Relenza was a good viable drug ...(coming out in nsal spray and intravenous forms soon).
I think the "mixup"with my mentioning Tamiflu along with the "amantadanes" seems to be in the report I got.
The newsletter hazily inferred that Tamiflu was also involved.
Between the writing and translations in this newsletter(they report from around the world..sometimes English not being a first language), either I must have slightly misread that line ... or they mumbled in that area.
So thanks for the clarification.
However, in any case, it is the whole idea of the resistance factor that is my main point here.
I, in no way am expert enough to differentiate classes of drugs, only able to pass on what seems to be important information.
BUT, If my blog had the effect of you stopping by and furthering the knowledge about useable and non useable drugs for this flu, then it did its job and that is, as Martha says,"A good thing."
As for you "harping," No problem. It is good you are "exacting."
Your "homework" on this subject , only convinces me further that you would be such an asset to the readers of these pages in keeping us updated on correct facts ...medical items and terms being so complicated and all with your own blog. :)
Although the list of useless drugs to fight this virus will keep growing, there is not much we ordinary folk can do...
The doctors and scientists will hopefully be better able to keep accounts of which, individual drugs are good and bad for this horrid bug.
And hopefully will have enough MONEY with which to do it.
As for Tamiflu. You bet I have some!
Got it last week, and suggest others follow suit too.
Even if this "pandemic" never arrives, better, "safe than sorry."
I cannot imagine wanting to go out (or being allowed out in Quarantine situations) so we may be on our own if this thing breaks open.
Working hard before winter sets in...so much to do...but hope to post new blog this week.
Stick around Sean...
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