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Danish wind power expert at Cape College Wednesday

08/28/06 · 3:14 pm :: posted by CCToday     

Will address controversies surrounding offshore wind farm
Speaker is the Director of the Copenhagen Environment and Energy Office

cape_wind_cap_t_02his Wednesday, August 30 at 7pm the Cape Cod Community College will host a short presentation by Jens Larsen, Director of the Copenhagen Environment and Energy Office and project manager for Denmark’s Middelgrunden offshore wind project.

A panel discussion and question and answer session will follow the presentation. The panel discussion is a part of Greenpeace’s clean energy tour of the Cape and Islands this summer highlighting the impacts of global warming and discussing real world experience with offshore wind projects. Denmark has nearly the same population as the state of Massachusetts, about twice the land area, and more than 900 times the installed wind power capacity.

jenshmlarsenSpeaking to legislators at the State House yesterday, Larsen said that the 20-turbine project off Copenhagen, Denmark's capital,  has not had radar, navigation, visual, environmental or fishing problems, as claimed by the opponents.

Larsen told them that the computer's software which interpret the radar signals were reprogrammed to account for the turbines. Reportedly radar problems in the UK led the Federal Aviation Administration to halt work on new wind turbines in the midwest earlier this summer until it was certain there were no problems.   

Who will speak:

Jens Larson, Director of the Copenhagen Environment and Energy Office and project manager for Denmark’s Middelgrunden offshore wind project. The author of several publications, Larson has served as the project manager on numerous wind energy projects and as a renewable energy advisor. He is also a member of the International Advisory Panel of Experts on Marine Ecology.

Jack Clarke, Director of Public Policy and Government Relations for Mass Audubon. Clarke previously served with the Governor’s Environmental Affairs Office; the U.S. National Park Service, and as an advisor to the first Bush Administration on off-shore oil and gas drilling.

Richard ElrickRichard Elrick, Nantucket Sound ferryboat captain of 25 years; attorney and former 3-term Barnstable town councilor. He is the President of Clean Power Now and also serves as the Vice-President of the Cape & Islands Self-Reliance Corp., a non-profit that promotes environmentally sound technologies and sustainable practices.

Upper Cape State Representative Matthew Patrick had invited Larsen speak to his peers. "It's been done in other places, and it works," Patrick said. "They had their problems in permitting it, too. There was a lot of skepticism. Now, it's pretty much evaporated. The apprehensiveness has evaporated." 

This event is free and open to the public.

WHEN: August 30 (Wednesday) 7-8pm
WHERE: Cape Cod Community College, 2240 Iyannough Road, West Barnstable, MA, Science Building, Lecture Hall A. Park in Lot 6 or 7
CONTACT: Jane Kochersperger, 202-319-2493; 202-415-5477(cell)
Information: see our web site here.

19 comments
Blog posts and comments are entirely the thoughts and ideas of the people who write them and in no way represent the views of CapeCodToday.com, eCape, Inc., or its employees or owners.

08/29/06 @ 9:32 am
Achilles [Member] writes:
"the computer's software which interpret the radar signals were reprogrammed to account for the turbines".

Gee, it was as simple as that? And the Danes have a lock on software mods that we don't? I wonder if the Danish CAA ordered a stopwork on all wind farms while they ran around in circles trying to fix the "problem"....

Why can't we get a grip?
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/29/06 @ 9:54 am
Monponsett [Member] writes:
Is Jens basically just a Danish version of our own Jacques Coleman?

Jens should have grabbed that Minister of the Environment around the neck and made her apologize for Pearl Harbor.

It'd be better if he were actually an American, but we all look alike to the Japanese.... the effect wouldn't be diminished much.
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/29/06 @ 10:46 am
neil good [Member] writes:
Intriguing headlines from Danish news stories and editorials;

“Subsidies to turbines out of control”
“Minister in conflict with the law”
“Gold for turbine owners”
“Out with the turbines”
“Electricity users led by the nose”
“Local politicians benefit from wind projects”
“Town council majority reported for tinkering with turbines”
“Windmills: not in my backyard”
“Power plants: Impossible to check turbine owners”
“Auken consulting about CO2 deception”
“Wind turbine fairytale for billions”
“Electricity customers cheated of billions”
“Openly cheating”
“Turbine swindle”
“Charge of cheating with turbines”
“Off-shore turbines cost electricity customers five billion”
“Electric shock”
“New billion bill to electricity users”
“Unpredictable Wind Energy”
“Massive protest against sea-turbines near Grenaa harbor”
“Loss on the sale of electricity”
“Green electricity is being sold at a loss”
“Wind turbines – complaints more than double”
“Green current is too difficult to control”
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/29/06 @ 11:12 am
Jack Coleman [Member] writes:
what's the asking price for that bridge, capri ...?
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/29/06 @ 12:46 pm
Achilles [Member] writes:
No, Capri, the Danes aren't as arrogant as we are (like, when they stage a world sporting event, they actually invite teams from other countries).

What they do have is proof, from radar studies, that when flocks of birds approach a wind farm, they actually fly around it! Those that don't go around it fly exactly half-way between the rows of turbines. It seems they're smarter than all those boat captains and pilots you folks are convinced will pile into the turbine towers en masse.

And if the paradoxically named Mr. Good wants to find out the truth about wind energy in Denmark, he might attend the symposium given by Jens Larsen, director of the Copenhagen Environment and Energy Office, tomorrow night at CCCC at 7pm. You can ask those questions directly, then, can't you, Mr. Good?
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/29/06 @ 3:00 pm
neil good [Member] writes:
Achilles,

I must say it's nice to see you have adopted a more careful- and civil- approach while communicating here. No doubt you remember Walter found it necessary to delete some of your earlier comments.

As for the “truth” about wind energy in Denmark, please keep in mind the headlines listed above, and the ones listed below, come from DANISH sources.

Sure, I might attend tomorrow’s lecture, and if I do, I may ask Mr. Larsen a question concerning his work at the Copenhagen Energy Office. I’d like to know if he could shed light on this report I found on the web earlier today;

“State Accountants have officially reprimanded the Danish Energy Agency for lack of control with windmill subsidies”

More headlines from Denmark…

“Danish wind: Too good to be true?”
“Danes blow away wealth in wind power exports”
“More wind turbines cause chaos”
“No carrot – therefore little new wind power”
“The most wind-deficient February ever”
“Wind turbines in fashion”
“Turbine parks: Shadow effect is felt five kilometres away”
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/29/06 @ 3:03 pm
neil good [Member] writes:
Continued-

“When the storm increased the turbines switched off”
“Out there without accelerator, steering wheel, clutch or brakes”
“Wind turbines stopped on New Year’s Day”
“Expensively bought wind power experiences in Denmark”
“Respect for the law as the wind blows”
“Wind power gilds Denmark”
“We will receive between 0 and 2,000 MW wind energy tomorrow”
“Wind turbines and windbags”
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/29/06 @ 4:07 pm
barbaradurkin [Member] writes:
Neil Good,

I must say you always complete your homework. Great information, as always, Neil. Thank you!
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/29/06 @ 5:52 pm
neil good [Member] writes:
Barbara,

And please allow me to thank you in turn for all you are doing to help stop this private ‘only for profit’ make-over/take-over of Nantucket Sound. You are a tough act to follow.
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/29/06 @ 5:59 pm
News-gal [Member] writes:
Neil & Babs - will you two just "get it on" and stop your "kiss-butt" dance in public.
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/29/06 @ 9:39 pm
Jane Kochersperger [Member] writes:
At what point will the subsidies we provide to coal or oil companies here be calculated in when you tabulate, Neil? Let's do full accounting if you must go there although I have a sense that Jens will dispense with your concerns adequately. If compelled to pursue this logic, then please also address some of the following as a starting point: why Massachusetts is in the position of accepting oil from Venezuala; why Germany & China are outstripping us re: wind development at a time when we can't part with SUVs and continue to fight a multi-billion war over oil which our economy is dependent on; why we are experiencing extreme uncertainty in the stock market as well as domestic manufacturing costs impacting Mom & Pop businesses as well as the soaring costs of childhood asthma med. bills which families are forced to foot themselves. This is a starting point if we are going to pursue the subsidy argument to address 'externalities.' I think the questions posed by the community are important and real-world experience and science should be given greater attention.
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/30/06 @ 1:36 am
neil good [Member] writes:
Jane,

Someday when you have time please read "Wind - Facts or blowing hot air?" by L. M. Schwartz.

http://www.sovereignty.net/p/clim/wind-leo.htm

...published by the Virginia Land Rights Coalition-

http://www.vlrc.org/about.html

From the conclusion;

"The wind power 'movement', supported by certain 'environmental' activists, the wind industry and government, to establish large-scale wind-generated electricity production is misconceived for two simple reasons. They believe wind power is exempt from immutable economic principles, and the laws of sound engineering and science."

"No amount of political meddling, government mandates, corporate profiteering or misguided good intentions and 'environmental responsibility' will change or negate those principles or laws."
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/30/06 @ 10:45 am
Jane Kochersperger [Member] writes:
Neil: Thanks for the recommendations re:articles. I'll read them this week. I'll be particularly interested in engineering and science data points. My earlier point however, is that if you are going to flag an issue such as subsidies, then you need to address it in toto and be clear on methodology so you can evaluate based on internal and external costs. At present, you are railing against wind re: subsidies without any context.

Naturally, that was just one topic that was highlighted in the article headers you posted.
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/30/06 @ 11:07 am
Jane Kochersperger [Member] writes:
Capri: I didn't say that it was more acceptable for our troops to die for oil than changing our habits as consumers. I was pointing out if you are going to deal with the economics of wind issues, then you need to account for the 'externalized' costs of existing energy policy. You can't have a discussion re: the economics of wind in a vacuum. I agree with you completely, that wasteful habits need to change, but we also need to pursue the development of energy sources that make us less dependent on oil.

RE: why is it more acceptable to destroy habitat than to enforce stricter emission laws, I don't think that really is the question. First, many ARE fighting to enforce stricter emission laws. Reality is that even when they are enforced, we will still need to develop cleaner sources of energy to meet growing demand. So, development is going to have to happen somewhere...the question is whether we will perpetuate the building of taxpayer subsidized nuclear plants and "clean coal" projects or if we are going to invest in energy projects that don't generate nuclear waste, etc.
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/30/06 @ 11:10 am
Jane Kochersperger [Member] writes:
Capri -

continued...I don't know which real scientists you are referring to and I never said it was acceptable to write anyone off so I don't know why you raise this with me. If you mean more broadly, then you need to name names as it pertains to this project as I can't respond to generalities as such.
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/30/06 @ 12:08 pm
nonesuch [Member] writes:
while you folks indulge in your xenophobic banter, note that upstate New York, home to Fort Drum and other military air installations near Rome and Syracuse, has its own highly successful wind facility. (see http://ekzept.livejournal.com/84285.html?thread=43069#t43069)

now, regarding radar: most military and other radar is indeed governed by computer software. there's plenty of expertise available in the U.S. and elsewhere (e.g., http://www.bwea.com/media/news/adt_trials.html) for how to mitigate interference.

frankly, the objections are disingenuous, as there is plenty of interference and backscatter from ground and air radar at civilian airports simply from the structures at the airport, from moving trucks, and from aircraft parked on the apron.

these adjustments need to be made to radar on a regular basis. there's nothing extraordinary about it.
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/30/06 @ 12:24 pm
Jack Coleman [Member] writes:
thanks for the insight, ekzept. A similar problem occurred a century ago with the new-fangled invention, the automobile. Seems that people who bought one of these contraptions for all of $600, a fortune in those days, weren't able to drive them when it rained, because the rain blurred their vision.

Then someone came up with an invention he or she called a "windshield." A step in the right direction, since rain no longer pelted the motorist in the eyes, but alas, it remained difficult to see beyond the windshield itself when it rained.

Faced with this dilemma, many people chose to condemn the new-fangled invention as hazardous to navigation and a grave threat to public safety.

Then another intrepid, entrepreneurial type came up with yet another invention -- the windshield wiper ...
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/30/06 @ 12:45 pm
neil good [Member] writes:
Jane,

I’m glad to see you recognize there are 'other' issues raised by those article headlines. Taken all together they bring to mind the line from Hamlet-

“Something is rotten in the State of Denmark”

For more on wind vs. fossil fuel subsidies see;

“Wind Power: Not Green but Red”

http://www.ncpa.org/prs/tst/20040501hsburnett.htm

“Comparing Wind Subsidies and Taxes to Conventional Fuels: Wind proponents often complain that it is unfair to single out tax credits and other forms of subsidies to their industry, or to renewable fuels in general, for attack, since, they argue, the fossil fuel industry receives subsidies as well. This is true as far as it goes, and, of course at the NCPA we argue for an end to subsidies for all forms of fuel – allowing the market to decide energy winners and losers. Whatever one thinks of subsidies, however, the truth is that the fossil fuel industry receives far less in subsidies per BTU equivalent than renewable fuels, and far less overall than they pay in excise taxes, income taxes, royalties and other fees or taxes...
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
08/30/06 @ 12:46 pm
neil good [Member] writes:
[continued]

"At more than $101 billion, the oil and gas industry pays 40 times more in royalties and taxes than the subsidies that it receives (a total of about $2.4 billion – which includes $.8 billion for the Low Income Heating Energy Assistance Program).
While fossil fuels combined, leaving out LEHEAP, do receive slightly more in subsidies in absolute dollars than renewables (excluding hydropower) combined ($1.6 billion vs. $1.1 billion), per unit of energy produced renewables receive more than 3 times the amount of subsidies that fossil fuels receive ($308 million per quadrillion BTU vs. 92 million per QBTU). And, unlike fossil fuels, renewables do not produce more in tax or income revenues than the subsidies that they receive."

"Conclusion. Wind power is expensive, doesn’t deliver the environmental benefits it promises and imposes substantial environmental costs. Accordingly, it does not merit continued government promotion or funding.”
 [ Show all comments by this user ]
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