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Cape Cod Commission subcommittee urges full commission vote against Cape Wind

Claims insufficient information about cable work

 By Jack Coleman for capecodtoday  

BARNSTABLE VILLAGE - Members of a Cape Cod Commission subcommittee voted unanimously today to recommend that the full commission turn down Cape Wind's application to bring its transmission cables ashore in Yarmouth to connect with a substation in Barnstable.

Today's vote on "procedural grounds without prejudice" was based on insufficient information about the cabling aspect of the project, according to subcommittee members. 

Assuming the full commission follows the subcommittee's recommendation by an Oct. 21 deadline, a likely scenario, a legal challenge from Cape Wind appears virtually certain. A vote by the full commission could take place on Oct. 18, the date of their last scheduled meeting before the deadline.

 Subcommittee members taking part in today's vote were chairwoman Elizabeth Taylor, Frank Hogan, Alan Platt, Chuck Lockhart, Joy Brookshire and John Harris, following a motion for the vote by Platt.

The vote took place at the end of a two-hour meetings in a cramped and crowded hearing room at the commission's offices in Barnstable village, following two previous meetings between subcommittee members, commission planners and representatives with Cape Wind in the last two weeks and a public hearing earlier this month that lasted 10 hours across two separate days.

Cape Wind and the commission have been locked in a tug of war for weeks, the commission repeatedly requesting more information about the cable work, Cape Wind responding that it has already complied or the information is not available at this point in the permitting process.

The specific areas of contention to arise today before the subcommittee's vote concerned open space mitigation, effects to eelgrass beds, payment of $30,000 from Cape Wind to monitor their effects of cabling on local ponds and Cape Wind's plan to bring its cables ashore at New Hampshire Avenue in Yarmouth, an area vulnerable to damage from hurricanes.

Cape Wind maintains that the commission is largely overstepping its juridiction authority due to a favorable vote by the state Energy Facilities Siting Board in May 2005 for Cape Wind's plan to connect to the regional grid.

Commission planners released a 29-page report outlining their concerns on Sept. 4 in anticipation of the public hearing opening two days later. Cape Wind's plans for cabling fell short of all but six of 33 "minimum performance standards" required of projects deemed Developments of Regional Impact (DRI).

Craig Olmsted, Cape Wind's vice president for projects, described the company's rationale for turning down the subcommittee's request for an extension of their review, a request made after Cape Wind agreed to a two-week extension on Sept. 11.

 "The jurisdictional cable is undergoing an unprecedented level of scrutiny for what is otherwise a routine installation of a cable to provide electricity to the Cape and islands," Olmsted said. "There are multiple agencies at the federal, state and local levels reviewing every aspect of this project. It is imperative to the project and the future of clean energy that permitting continue to progress at all levels.

"Cape Wind believes that the record before the commission is complete and exhaustive and is adequate to base its decision on," Olmsted said. "The information the commission has reviewed has, for the most part, been available for several years and any additional information requested by the commission has been submitted in a timely manner. While we respect the jurisdiction of the Cape Cod Commission, we also understand the timeframes dictated by the Legislature for the commission's review to be important tools to ensure a project is evaluated in a timely and efficient manner."

Olmsted added that "to my knowledge, there is more known about the transmission line and more care taken in mitigation than any project that has preceded it. We don't see any point in prolonging the process when by all standards the record is complete and process can and should move forward. With all due respect, we do not feel that it is fair or necessary to extend the review for this DRI project."

Cape Wind agreed to provide $10.2 million in mitigation funding

Cape Wind agreed to provide $10.2 million in mitigation funding to offset impacts from the project back in March when Ian Bowles, the state's Secretary of Energy and Environmental Affairs, ruled that the project as proposed complied with the state's environmental laws.

But how that mitigation funding would be spent, and whether any would make its way to the commission or town of Yarmouth, were contentious issues at today's meeting.

Phil Dascombe, the commission's lead planner overseeing the review, said the mitigation funds would be controlled by the state office of Coastal Zone Management, with no specific money allocated to the commission or towns of Yarmouth and Barnstable. Cape Wind's underground cable would pass through both towns' waters and land before connecting to an NStar substation in Barnstable.

"It would seem that everyone will be dipping into that money," said subcommittee member Chuck Lockhart.

Yarmouth Selectmen Chairwoman Suzanne McAuliffee said Yarmouth officials were not receiving the information they needed from Cape Wind and had directed town counsel to review the town's agreement as host community where Cape Wind's cables would come ashore.

Charles McLaughlin, an attorney with the town of Barnstable, urged the subcommittee against a recommendation "without findings or prejudice" as leaving the commission vulnerable on appeal. McLaughlin urged members not to vote in the absence of an analysis of whether Cape Wind's benefits outweigh its drawbacks.

Such an analysis was already undertaken by Cape Wind and approved by the state Energy Facilities Siting Board, said Cape Wind attorney David Rosenzeig.

McLaughlin added that the town is preparing a legal challenge to the state decision announced by Bowles in March.

Cape Wind's plans to use jet plowing to lay its two cables under the seabed, and whether this in effect constitutes dredging, also remains a bone of contention between the company and commission.  Jet plowing would also be used to connect cables from all 130 turbines situated across 24 square miles of Nantucket Sound with a transformer platform. The transformer would be roughly 12 miles from projected landfall at New Hampshire Avenue in Yarmouth.

The absence of an emergency response plan from Cape Wind in catastrophic accidents involving Cape Wind's turbines or its transformer platform, where 40,000 gallons of coolant would be stored, did not sit well with subcommittee members.

Lockhard read from a recent Business Week magazine article describing "thousands" of "mishaps, breakdowns and accidents" involving wind turbines elsewhere in the US and Europe. In one case, according to the article, a turbine blade sheared off and was flung 200 meters away, presumably in Europe.

"You got propellers out there and they are going to come off and go through someone's boat," Lockhart warned.

Not only that, suggested subcommittee member Joy Brookshire, Cape Wind could also become a vulnerable target to terrorists. 

(See previous story, Another CC Commission meeting on Cape Wind's cables)

56 comments
Blog posts and comments are entirely the thoughts and ideas of the people who write them and in no way represent the views of CapeCodToday.com, eCape, Inc., or its employees or owners.

09/24/07 @ 1:58 pm
susan [Member] writes:
^5 to the Cape Cod Commission, and I don't live on the Compound.
09/24/07 @ 3:06 pm
bobcat87 [Member] writes:
I'm with you Susan -- like most opponents of this poorly sited industrial project, I am just an "ordinary" citizen who sees a developer's boondoggle for what it is. I commend the CCC for exerting their control and speaking for those who will be most affected by the project. ACT LOCALLY!
09/24/07 @ 3:18 pm
lmc035@gmail.com [Member] writes:
In Sections III.C.2.a, III.C.2.b, and III.C.2.c, above, the Siting Board has reviewed the
record evidence regarding the marine construction impacts, the land-based construction impacts,
and the permanent impacts of the proposed transmission lines, and has imposed mitigation where
necessary to minimize the environmental impacts of the proposed transmission lines. Based on
its review of the record, the Siting Board finds that Cape Wind has provided sufficient
information regarding environmental impacts and potential mitigation measures to allow us to
determine that it has achieved the proper balance among environmental impacts.
09/24/07 @ 3:43 pm
maverick [Member] writes:
Thanks CCC...at last a commission immune to politics and money. Win or lose these folks have provided hope that this project will not be railroaded by the developer's
financial contributions.

Common sense rules. Maybe CCT and Jack C. will follow suit at some point.

Susan thanks for your support. I don't live in the compound either. I live on Nantucket Sound. It needs all the protection and support we can give it.

It is a lovely child in relation to time. One of the last bastions of beauty on the Cape. Please help save it from industrial development.
09/24/07 @ 4:13 pm
lmc035@gmail.com [Member] writes:
I wonder why the CCC is interested in those funds?? More jobs for CCC staff?
09/24/07 @ 5:14 pm
bittersweet [Member] writes:
Ok maverick, but what's going to have to get destroyed so you can have your lovely child? If you want to keep nature pure, and don't want to have to keep digging it up and shaving it off and polluting it with chemicals.....then:1. stop driving huge suvs's and trucks. 2. Stop living in huge mansions.3. As my friend from Macedonia says; you Americans are 10% of the population, but use 90% of the world's resources!(an exageration, but you get it) You want it all, with none of the sacrifices the whole rest of the world is making. we wouldn't have a problem if not for greed, and that is not going away any time soon. So, maybe you'll have to lose a bastion of beauty...you sure won't be the 1st!
09/24/07 @ 5:28 pm
lmc035@gmail.com [Member] writes:
Wow. And I thought these commission memebers were somewhat informed...
09/24/07 @ 5:54 pm
neil good [Member] writes:
Moses, it seems as though the CCC members have learned a great deal about wind as a 'power' source. Look online for the new essay- “Wind-Driven Delusions” by Alan Caruba. He included a few lines about Cape Wind, and this-

“...Wind farms are quite possibly the dumbest way possible to produce electricity.”
09/24/07 @ 6:03 pm
bittersweet [Member] writes:
As Reaguns always said, "trust, but verify"...who is Alan Caruba, and who does he work for?

And are you saying that those Europeans are all dumb?
09/24/07 @ 6:10 pm
christy [Member] writes:
If you liked the Big Dig, you'll love Cape Wind---
In 1986 the BIG Dig was projected to cost $2.3 Billion. From that date to present day the following agencies have had oversight of the project:
Executive Office of Transportation
Mass Highway
Massachusetts State Auditor
Massachusetts Inspector General
Massachusetts Attorney General
House Transportation Committee
Senate Transportation Commitee
Massachusetts Turnpike Authority
US Senate Committee on Commerce
US House Transportation Committee
US Department of Transportation
US Federal Highway Administration
Today the Project Cost exceeds $15Billion---the Project is riddled with mistakes.
The new players regarding overight are:
FBI
DOT Inspector General
US Department of Justice
Please, let the Cape Cod Commission do its job with regard to Cape Wind. If one of the above had, the Commonwealth would not be the laughingstock of the county regarding the Big Dig. CCC protect Cape Cod.
09/24/07 @ 6:39 pm
bittersweet [Member] writes:
Protect Cape Cod? Have you looked around you lately?? That reminds me of a cartoon that was in the opinion section of the paper once....picture a big strip of road with stores everywhere, cars everywhere, signs everywhere, new luxury condominioums being built everywhere, and the caption reads: "Furthermore, a wind farm would ruin our pristine views." The CCC and developers sure don't mind ruining some views, i geuss.
09/24/07 @ 6:43 pm
neil good [Member] writes:
Who is Alan Caruba? Glad you asked. Among other things, he is the founder of the “National Anxiety Center, where the good news is… the bad news is WRONG!”

“Those” Europeans- which ones do you have in mind? I admire many Europeans, especially those who stand up and question wind power. Take for example the people mentioned in this Copenhagen Post story-

“Energy Giants Think Wind Power is Just Hot Air”

Jan. 25, 2007

“The country’s energy companies are not convinced that wind power is the way of the future. Management at Denmark’s energy companies, DONG Energy and Vattenfall, do not subscribe to the current mindset that wind energy will be especially prominent in the future, national broadcaster DR has reported.”

“The companies believe that coal-powered electricity will still be the largest supplier of the nation’s energy, despite the trend toward enviro. friendly sources. ‘Wind energy can’t solve the energy problem in the near future because it’s too unstable and possibly too expensive,’ said A. Eldrup, CEO of Dong Energy."
09/24/07 @ 6:51 pm
bittersweet [Member] writes:
"Big Coal is in deep trouble and wants Congress to provide a massive
federal bailout. Since the beginning of 2006 at least two dozen new
coal-fired electric power plants have been canceled, most for
environmental reasons.
Last week Alan Greenspan, the nation's financial elder statesman,
acknowledged that the Iraq war "is largely about oil." Big Coal is
hoping instability in the Middle East will spook Congress into a $10
billion subsidy for 10 or more coal-to-liquid (CTL) plants, to make
diesel fuel from coal instead of from oil. Coal-to-liquid (CTL) is Big
Coal's best hope for remaining viable, but the chances of success
grow dimmer each passing day." Peter Montague
09/24/07 @ 7:20 pm
deltaman [Member] writes:
B'sweet, I want a full list of those who called you a "dumb broad" - gonna tan some hides , I am!

(Your reason rings clear to me…)
09/24/07 @ 7:48 pm
bittersweet [Member] writes:
Since we met, I knew you were my protector deltaman. But geez, is it a full moon coming, or what? I feel the hair of the dog biting, and i don't even drink anymore! And since we've been quoting song lyrics recently, here's one from Big Head Todd and the Monsters....."more bitter than sweet" . that about says it! But, anyway, you always cheer things up, and that's a great gift!!!
09/24/07 @ 7:50 pm
bittersweet [Member] writes:
I meant met on the web!! don't read anything into it --you know who you are.
09/25/07 @ 6:48 am
Sacreblu [Member] writes:
Gee, hasn't anyone told the Commish that the State Facilities Siting Board recently ignored another attempt in the SAME AREA to block a new cable to Nantucket.

The new Exec. Dir. is pretty kewl - send it back to9 the full Commish where it will wither and die.
09/25/07 @ 7:59 am
bittersweet [Member] writes:
FOR WOMEN ONLY.....I told my friend how I was feeling last night, and she sent me this; hope it works this way, or maybe you can just google it. It's pretty funny. LISA_KOCH_middle_aged.mp3
09/25/07 @ 11:47 pm
barbaradurkin [Member] writes:
Brilliantly summarized, Christy, I love it!!! We have the Big Dig whistleblower, blowing the whistle on Cape Wind, how rich, how true, Christy, thank you.

If you liked the Big Dig, you'll love Cape Wind---
In 1986 the BIG Dig was projected to cost $2.3 Billion. From that date to present day the following agencies have had oversight of the project:
Executive Office of Transportation
Mass Highway
Massachusetts State Auditor
Massachusetts Inspector General
Massachusetts Attorney General
House Transportation Committee
Senate Transportation Commitee
Massachusetts Turnpike Authority
US Senate Committee on Commerce
US House Transportation Committee
US Department of Transportation
US Federal Highway Administration
Today the Project Cost exceeds $15Billion---the Project is riddled with mistakes.
The new players regarding overight are:
FBI
DOT Inspector General
US Department of Justice
Please, let the Cape Cod Commission do its job with regard to Cape Wind. If one of the above had, the Commonwealth would not be the laughingstock of the county regarding the Big Dig. CCC protect Cape Cod.
09/26/07 @ 8:25 am
Democrant [Member] writes:
First, I want to commend Jack for a well written article, though I suspect my praise to him is considered faint praise ;)

Here's what I would say to those in opposition to the project, a position that I lean towards. And I'll add to the supporters, the constant refrain of NIMBYism doesn't help. But specifically to opponents; are there any conditions imagineable that you could define some sort of wind project in Nanticket Sound that would sufficiently address concerns raised? Pretend there is no Cape Wind project on the books. Someone says, you know, from a standpoint of producing wind power, the Sound has a lot of potential, how do we do this?
09/26/07 @ 9:07 am
susan [Member] writes:
"We" abandon this already obsolete project and support soon to be deep water projects with a far greater potential.
09/26/07 @ 9:27 am
deltaman [Member] writes:
Susan, I'm still getting up to (wind) speed; will you please elaborate - "greater potential" for what?
09/26/07 @ 9:36 am
susan [Member] writes:
....... for electricity, that will actually benefit "WE"
09/26/07 @ 10:03 am
deltaman [Member] writes:
OK, gotcha. But I'm seeing claims here that put commercial feasibility of "deep water" 'bout a decade out… If so, maybe all water will be deeper then, since polar caps will be gone… Do you have a safe, "right now" suggestion to reduce fossil fuel use/global warming/melting mastodon poo (truth!!!) et al?
09/26/07 @ 10:23 am
neil good [Member] writes:
Google- “MORE ON THE "MAMMOTH DUNG" FANTASY” and read the article on Greeniewatch.

Then look for- “Scientists Counter AP Article Promoting Computer Model Climate Fears” on the U.S. Senate Environment and Public Works Committee Web site.

“…Nearly two dozen prominent scientists from around the world have denounced a recent Associated Press article promoting sea level fears in the year 2100 and beyond based on unproven computer models predictions.”

Sample- “...Dr. Richard S. Courtney, a climate and atmospheric science consultant and a UN IPCC expert reviewer ridiculed the AP article- “Rarely have I read such a collection of unsubstantiated and scare-mongering twaddle. Not only do real studies show no increase to rate of sea level change, the [AP] article gives reasons for concern that are nonsense,”
09/26/07 @ 10:33 am
susan [Member] writes:
Maybe you need to do some research/reading beyond this site. It appears a "decade out" may be sooner than you think, right here in the good old USA.
A right now solution you ask; everyone give up their vehicles and buy a horse ;)
I once met a tree hugger by a lake in VT. She arrived in an very old gas guzzling , polluting, old Ford pick up, with her kayak. We were camping near the waters edge. She proceeded to lecture us on proper camping and not using soap to bathe in the river. Mind you, she had no evidence that we had, or even intended to. I looked at her truck and asked her how much carbon monoxide that thing was expelling into the air, and how much fuel did it burn. Her reply "well I had to get my kayak here. I don't believe in motorized boats, they pollute the waters."
09/26/07 @ 10:49 am
deltaman [Member] writes:
Susan, I've followed most of the links suggested previously here, and I'm always eager to see informed facts - or even informed opinions. I put forth a sincere request to you for information. Are you willing to share any links to your sources of info?
I did very-much enjoy your kayak-lady vignette; further pointing-up the hypocrisy found in so many global warming & energy-related discussions…(tia)
09/26/07 @ 11:14 am
neil good [Member] writes:
"Giant Wind Turbines"

"Floating wind farms placed far offshore could lead to affordable electricity"

http://www.technologyreview.com/read_article.aspx?id=16801

"...Based on wind-speed measurements, researchers at MIT, led by Stephen Connors, director of the Analysis Group for Regional Electricity Alternatives, calculated that large turbines located far offshore could ultimately cost less per power generated than either land-based turbines or near-offshore ones, even factoring in extra costs, such as much longer underground electricity transmission cables. The upside: much more fast and steady wind, which would allow the turbines to generate power at 50 percent capacity on average throughout the year, compared with 30 percent or less with on-land turbines."
09/26/07 @ 11:26 am
susan [Member] writes:
Google Delta. I don't save all that I have read. Engineers deep water platforms, MIT, Texas deep water wind, LA deepwater, Europe... etc etc. off the top of my head.. I believe Tx will be the first in the US. Which brings us to Kings of oil, shall be Kings of Wind.
09/26/07 @ 11:43 am
susan [Member] writes:
Thanks Neil. I am presently working on a web store and don't have time do Delta's homework for him today lol :)
09/26/07 @ 12:26 pm
Jack Coleman [Member] writes:
Not taken that way at all, Democrant, thanks for the compliment.
09/26/07 @ 3:28 pm
deltaman [Member] writes:
Susan, sadly you once-again offer only a tantalizing flash of your brilliance before again ducking into the shadows… You may choose to thank Neil for staging that daring daylight rescue of your honor, but I've found nothing in his remarks & references to suggest that there's any proposed deep water siting that would be economically-feasible without 1st inventing multiple technologies - with unproven safety - that don't yet exist. Sadly, I'm again confronted with another example of a card in common play around this issue -"Obfuscation as the Bastion of a Psuedo-Progressive Environmentalist" - What's in YOUR kayak, Susan? Mastodon poo?

=:(
09/26/07 @ 4:34 pm
bittersweet [Member] writes:
I am just not understanding this "logic"....Wait till the turbines can go further out, and then it will be worth it?
Maverick said we would pay MORE with the wind-farm!?
09/26/07 @ 4:36 pm
deltaman [Member] writes:
B'sweet, you're such a tease! Where do you see any "logic" in play?
09/26/07 @ 5:02 pm
maverick [Member] writes:
deltaman...while you play judge and jury for any and all CCT blog comments please get up to speed and do a little research.

Please show me evidence of any wind factory in the U.S. reducing the cost of electricity.
09/26/07 @ 5:41 pm
bittersweet [Member] writes:
It's not all about reducing costs, you know. It's about doing something else besides relying on oil, coal, nuclear,for our energy.It's about trying something different. That will maybe help out in the long-run too. And maybe the benefit will outweigh what you see as the problem.
09/26/07 @ 6:19 pm
susan [Member] writes:
Deltaman; Just because you have nothing better to do, don't assume the rest of us don't either. You play the "I haven't come to a decision card" to amuse yourself and egg on debates. I haven't bought your game here since day one. Lucky for you, the only one I see biting is Bittersweet. I gave you search leads which you obviously did not utilize. There was some very informative news as recent as yesterday on deepwater, if you had bothered to look. Is this message board attention game the way you decide on whom you will elect for President also? I mean so far you are here "deciding" on the Wamanoag's, the casino, wind.. did I leave anything out? Sit here and play dumb for attention, but don't expect everyone else to play your game.
Sorry, your words of
"bait " just don't make me jump.
09/26/07 @ 6:27 pm
Jack Coleman [Member] writes:
Yes, Neil, and "ultimately" it may prove less costly to extract copper from the moon. Not now, but "ultimately."

I've yet to hear an opponent of the wind farm answer this question, but what the hay, maybe I'll get lucky this time - Neil, if farther offshore is the way to go ... right? ... why isn't anyone actually doing it?
09/26/07 @ 8:04 pm
deltaman [Member] writes:
Mav, don't hurt me - I'm far from being a card-carrying proponent - credible KWh$ estimates stray little from a wash, & I still find the environmental concerns (unknowns) way-scary. The spin on my position? Spend more time to fully-understand & minimize environmental risks; if that's even feasible, then, I'd accept a small increase per kilowatt to buy a bit of breathing room for adopting a real energy policy. I'm both grateful & exasperated that you appear to be one of a minority here who addresses how much siting plays a role in both risks & economics; coastal ecosystems are so unique that I'm reluctant to believe there are any one-size-fits-all solutions that are easily & safely transferrable to Cap Cod. This is one of the most contentious online debates I've ever witnessed; I can see the reasons for strong passions on all sides' I just wish that people weren't ignoring the "science" which doesn't support their view. If a roll of the dice or who bellows loudest remain the only choices, then I'm squarely behind (c) - None of the Above. Apologies to anyone inconvenienced by that!
09/26/07 @ 8:20 pm
neil good [Member] writes:
“...if farther offshore is the way to go ... right? ... why isn't anyone actually doing it?”

This could be your lucky break Jack, unless you try to tell me 130 kilometers off the German coast does not qualify as “farther offshore.”

http://www.abb.com/cawp/gad02181/306c726f332f36d3c1257353003b91f0.aspx

“Borkum 2 wind farm will consist of 80 wind generators of 5 MW located about 130 km from the coast in the North Sea...”
09/26/07 @ 8:31 pm
deltaman [Member] writes:
Susan, I've seen that your requests for info are treated respectfully, without challenge to credibility, so I'm puzzled by your own intolerance!

As an engineer & "treehugger" I have a keen sense of risks vs how little we know about the ocean ecosystems that some have already "signed-on" to exploit. These concerns are forcing me to very cautious about what possible elements of an energy present & energy future I should choose to support. I've spent hours pursuing suggested links; so far, I'm finding a lot-less credible science than copious amounts of feel-good rhetoric from all sides. I'm sad to see that you're unwilling to follow your own advice (just yesterday) to respect & tolerate all views & styles of expressing them. To now, I've appreciated the hard info you bring to the table on occasion. However, since you now appear to even be antagonized by my presence here, I see our opportunities for constructive exchanges dwindling. Here's the best deal I can offer short of disappearing - I'll not bother you with anymore insincere questions, if you'll stop Pontificating - Deal?

:(
09/26/07 @ 8:36 pm
bittersweet [Member] writes:
Terry, Upland, USA
Why are so many people ignoring the evidence,as presented by 99% of climate change scientists,and as seen through the eyes of all whose lives have been ruined already by climate change,and by those with open eyes (and seen in increasing numbers by many who have been denying climate change for ideological reasons, until now).It should be obvious now to even a Clarkson that something is happening..and it isn't good.Perhaps we as people in the West have lost the capacity to act collectively,and are now honed only towards individual and familial satisfaction (forget the descendants...you will be long gone before climate change gets them).If its a test,we are failing it,but never mind,profit,luxury and convenience come first,and those who disagree are just weird,idealists with too much time on their hands.Forward to melting point..with Easyjet,Top Gear,Dubya and all the big polluters.
09/26/07 @ 8:39 pm
bittersweet [Member] writes:
Dont' worry about Susan deltaman...she's been nasty since day one! Can I say that? just my opinion.
09/26/07 @ 9:48 pm
neil good [Member] writes:
Global warming might be taken more seriously when a winner can claim this prize-

“Ultimate Global Warming Challenge Ups Prize Money to $125,000 for Proving Humans Cause Catastrophic Climate Change”

www.UltimateGlobalWarmingChallenge.com

The Ultimate Global Warming Challenge announced today that it raised to $125,000 the cash award to the first person to prove in a scientific manner that human emissions of greenhouse gases will cause catastrophic global climate change.

"Surprisingly no one has entered the contest yet," said Steven Milloy, founder and publisher of www.JunkScience.com

"It appears that $100,000 is not enough to spur Al Gore and other climate alarmists to submit their proofs that humans are causing global warming," explained Milloy. "If it's a matter of money, Al Gore and the alarmists should just come out and tell us what sum it will cost the rest of us to see what proof they have."
09/26/07 @ 9:53 pm
deltaman [Member] writes:
Since we 1st met, B'sweet. I knew that you were my protector…

=;)

(Btw, you doo Yahoo, troo? - what happened to that email?)
09/26/07 @ 9:59 pm
bittersweet [Member] writes:
I don't care who wins some stupid contest, and I don't care what the facts, figures,scientists, egg-heads, experts say.....i can SEE the problem when I drive to Providence via new Bedford and Fall River. And I can SMELL the problem driving down the mid-cape highway!!! If you seriously want me, and any normal 8 year old for that matter, to live on this planet, and not see the damage that WE humans have done, then you have at it. I don't need a climatologist degree to know the earth is damaged, and the air stinks, and the ugly smoke hanging with the clouds is not good for anything or anybody. But, you go ahead and demand facts and figures to support your cause. i can always look them up too.
meanwhile, here's a poem i read long ago:(or maybe it's a haiku)
Hate, like molten lead
Drips from the wounded sky
They call it air-pollution
09/26/07 @ 10:03 pm
bittersweet [Member] writes:
See how charming you are d-man? And yes, I answered it!? Please check again, since I do realize i have been abusing this site for my own personal use, and that must stop.
09/26/07 @ 10:59 pm
deltaman [Member] writes:
Guess, I've missed or overlooked instances of what you're calling personal abuse, B'sweet. (Sadly, appears to be one of the few topics that can be discussed amicably here.)

Charming, you think? Well, you just made a short list, fer shua.

Imo, when we have occasion to differ with "friends" viewpoints, our discussions have better chance for finding solutions that reflect~ respect all views… And, if compromise isn't possible, then you've still got your friend the next day…

No one has yet convinced me that making acquaintances here, & learning enough about 'em to at least respect them - even possibly admire them - isn't going to improve the overall tone & quality of these discussions. - I am absolutely unswerving in that belief, and unrepentant about my efforts in its service. (Now if I just could figure-out how to attach chill pills to some emails…)

=;)
09/27/07 @ 6:45 am
bittersweet [Member] writes:
Yeah, well, it seems that this must be "serious issues only". And "stick to the topic".But I agree with you...it's nice to sometimes be a person rather than an opinion!
09/27/07 @ 6:58 am
maverick [Member] writes:
Jack C and deltaman...Dona T has provided an additional resource and facts that support my waterfowl migration observations.

"1,000,000s pass over Sound, esp. in fall•Most groups fly on broad front, some more concentrated•Most flight nocturnal"

http://www.mtpc.org/offshore/Mostellobackup.pdf

If anyone would like to witness this treasure please visit http://www.maverickchartersltd.com and I will take you to Monomoy on a fall evening as my guest at no charge.
09/27/07 @ 7:56 am
deltaman [Member] writes:
Jack, I admire you for leading with your heart that way!

Although inland from you, a similar nighttime spectacular will soon commence over our own property, & lasts for about a week or more. We're at a bit of elevation here & the honking increases as they pump harder to gain altitude. Some mornings we discover feathery evidence of skirmishes with the taller treetops. At its zenith, the nighttime honking overhead is so loud & prolonged, we're forced to close the bedroom windows to get any sleep. The term "silly goose" is appropriately singular - as a flock, silhouetted by a full moon, they are magical & majestic! Before moving in 10 years ago, we weren't "warned" But If we ever sell this place, I want it to be to folks who will appreciate this spectacle as much as we have…

(Interesting NPR segment yesterday, on birds navigating with magnetic compasses located in their eyes. That pinpoint accurate compass appears to be both a strength & a weakness; whitnessing the flocks' decade of treetop encounters here, I see no signs of them re-programming locked-in coordinates…)
09/27/07 @ 8:01 am
deltaman [Member] writes:
I'm Red-faced, Maverick! Hope you recognized that I was referring to you…
09/27/07 @ 9:46 am
susan [Member] writes:
I don't know if any of you are familiar with the Downvind Project =Distant Offshore Windfarms with no Visual impact IN Deep Water. Downvind is Europe's largest renewable energy program. Talisman Energy working with Downvind, installed 2 deepwater demonstrator towers this past July along side their Beatrice project in Scotland. Quite an interesting project. They do not and will not know the impact on migratory birds, until studies are completed on the standing project. I find that interesting as, here in the sound, the towers aren't up, yet people say it will have no effect on the birds due to studies on sites in Europe. My take is, no one knows what the impact would be, before towers are placed in bird migration areas. Even despite extensive studies in Europe, mapped migration, they still cannot predict the impact wind towers will have on migratory birds.
09/27/07 @ 12:23 pm
neil good [Member] writes:
Great point Susan.

Jack, I’m surprised you have nothing to say about the Borkum-2 project, 130 kilometers [or about 80 miles] off the coast of Germany.

As you would say, the silence is deafening.

From your comment above-

“I've yet to hear an opponent of the wind farm answer this question, but what the hay, maybe I'll get lucky this time - Neil, if farther offshore is the way to go ... right? ... why isn't anyone actually doing it?"
09/27/07 @ 7:01 pm
bittersweet [Member] writes:
"If anyone would like to witness this treasure please visit http://www.maverickchartersltd.com and I will take you to Monomoy on a fall evening as my guest at no charge."
I think you should take some people who are forced to live near those horrid poison-spewing oil refineries. They'd probably aprreciate it very much. In fact, they probably would really like to just take one breath of fresh air before they die....
09/27/07 @ 7:13 pm
maverick [Member] writes:
bittersweet...you are always welcome to view the birds and smell the fresh air off Monomoy.

Sweet Dreams.
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